Riding Blind with your DSMB reel

[PfcAJ]

Only for the original plan, if things change and you get to increase the bottom time with all those problems, then it will turn ugly, I can increment the times of the stops on bottom gas at 24m by double, and the ones on 50% by 1/3 at 12m, the ones on 80%, at 9m by 1/3 addicional time and double the time at 6m, taking in account that the dive shal be calculated to 40% CNS, so you don't go over the 100% CNS, then switch to the 21% as long as possible, then cross your fingers to not get a hit at surface.

I have heard about the ratio deco, that it can help you in these scenarios, but I don't know nothing about it, for me I think it will be easier to increase to calculate times taken in consideration the CNS exposure.

What do you suggest will be a better way, or how do you do it ?

I'm not even sure what you're trying to say in the 1st paragraph.

Anyways, time spent studying the relationship between timenat depth and deco time is worthwhile. Learning about RD can be a powerful tool to help.

Honestly dude, I think you need to be retrained by someone else. There's a LOT of gaps. Just an assessment, not a dig at you. It's not your fault.

 

[Remy B.]

I'm not even sure what you're trying to say in the 1st paragraph.

Anyways, time spent studying the relationship between timenat depth and deco time is worthwhile. Learning about RD can be a powerful tool to help.

Honestly dude, I think you need to be retrained by someone else. There's a LOT of gaps. Just an assessment, not a dig at you. It's not your fault.

Note that what I posted is a reflection of my own of how I think I can get out of the water but staying in the CNS and not my INTS, I only was introduced to VPM, and went thru a lot of dives with my instructor before he allowed me to take the exam, but I was not introduced thru the different techniques of decompression.

AJ, will it not be good first that I get more experience and do my Trimix course before I get to learn the Ratio Deco information ?, I only dive air or Helitrox, I think that 60m is enough for me for the coming years.

if you think that it is worth to take now, is this a good option ?

Ratio Deco 2.0 · UTD Scuba Diving

 

[Bennno]

AJ, will it not be good first that I get more experience and do my Trimix course before I get to learn the Ratio Deco information ?, I only dive air or Helitrox, I think that 60m is enough for me for the coming years.

if you think that it is worth to take now, is this a good option ?

I suppose Aj meant you should get retrained at your level by another instructor... an instructor that's not advising his stundents to do the 'two finger tight 2nd stages', deep air and stuff like that. That instructor might not be the best trainer around.

 

[The Chairman]

will it not be good first that I get more experience and do my Trimix course before I get to learn the Ratio Deco information ?,

Please, please, please be careful with Ratio Deco. According to one of the physicians at DAN, the chance of being bent by ratio deco is far, far higher than using tables or a PDC. Since it's all in your mind, just a little narcosis can have disastrous results. I certainly won't ever use it and I've been diving since 1969 without any signs of DCS.

 

[PfcAJ]

Please, please, please be careful with Ratio Deco. According to one of the physicians at DAN, the chance of being bent by ratio deco is far, far higher than using tables or a PDC. Since it's all in your mind, just a little narcosis can have disastrous results. I certainly won't ever use it and I've been diving since 1969 without any signs of DCS.

Ugh. The ascent you get with RD is THE SAME as with tables or a dive computer.

 

[The Chairman]

Ugh. The ascent you get with RD is THE SAME as with tables or a dive computer.

Who cares about the rate of ascent? It's the mental mistakes that are the real problem with RD. PDCs don't get narced. They don't forget, either. They work or they fail so badly it's obvious. So, I carry two. Doesn't stop me from thinking and assessing during the dive, but I'm not constantly distracted by the process either. But again, the big problem is the increased rate of DCS among those who use RD. That's enough for me to avoid it. Nothing down there worth getting hurt over.

 

[PfcAJ]

Who cares about the rate of ascent? It's the mental mistakes that are the real problem with RD. PDCs don't get narced. They don't forget, either. They work or they fail so badly it's obvious. So, I carry two. Doesn't stop me from thinking and assessing during the dive, but I'm not constantly distracted by the process either. But again, the big problem is the increased rate of DCS among those who use RD. That's enough for me to avoid it. Nothing down there worth getting hurt over.

Uhh...rate of ascent is the whole game, Pete. Ascend too fast and you get bent.

If RD produces the same ascent as x algorithm, and that algorithm's ascent is ok, the the RD ascent is also ok.

If you ignore your tables or computer (or input the wrong info into your computer) you also might get bent the same way you might get bent if you ignore your RD ascent schedule. That isn't a problem with RD any more than misreading tables is a problem with tables.

 

[boulderjohn]

If you ignore your tables or computer (or input the wrong info into your computer) you also might get bent the same way you might get bent if you ignore your RD ascent schedule. That isn't a problem with RD any more than misreading tables is a problem with tables.

Come on.

Two of my friends got bent using Ratio Deco on a pretty simple deco dive even though they were doing their best to follow its precepts. Neither was an idiot--one had a Ph.D in computer science. Because one of them was using a computer in gauge mode, they had a complete log of the actual dive, which they were then able to compare to the dive they thought they had done. It showed that they had made three mistakes. They had miscalculated their average depth before ascending. They had ascended to the first deep stop much too slowly. They had then miscalculated their deco stops. If they had not made those three mistakes, they probably would have been fine, but they were using a system that allowed them to make those mistakes.

You can say the same thing would have happened if both of them had ignored their computers, but you would have trouble keeping a straight face as you said it.

 

[The Chairman]

.rate of ascent is the whole game,

Deco is a function of time and depth and is mitigated by our rate of ascent.

you also might get bent

The frequency for getting bent while using a PDC or tables is considered no more than "noise" by the deco scientists. The frequency for being bent on RD is significantly higher. When I talked about RD with one of the DAN docs, his eyebrows raised in alarm and his first comment was "Please, don't tell me that you're into Ratio Deco." My feeling about all the people getting bent on it was apocryphal up till that point. Not so much any more.

 

[C Dub]

Pete, I suggest you break the RD discussion into a new thread "RD Throwdown".

/popcorn