purchasing equipment saturday

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jeez i went to work for 10 hours and this thing turned ugly....I wasn't saying anything bad about the the dive shop and I did say it was 1 of 3 packs that were available, unfortunatetly for my husband and I lwe like the equipment better in the higher range as we rented them and are comfortable with them. I had no intentions of this turning into a battle of LDS versus online. I personaly would rather buy local then over the net. Now I have no clue what we are doing but I can tell you this it isn't going to be happening on Saturday.

I didn't think Paul would need to defend himself on here and would like to apologize that he felt it needed to be done, I had no intentions of naming the shop and I'm sure I would have found out that his prices are good when I looked around a bit locally. The problem is we are like Paul stated and I believe i did in my orginal post new to the sport. Paul I look forward to speaking with you directly regarding this.
 
pgdive:
Damselfish

All of the equipemnt is stuff that we believe in and dive with or else why would we sell it. By "picking" the more expensive equipement all I'm doing is giving people a discount on some of the higher end gear that we persnally use regualry. It's not any more complicated than that. There is only so much information that I can put on a piece of paper. Threee pacakage at different price ranges with different features That's all.



Paul

There's nothing wrong with providing a Good, Better, Best. It's especially important for a new diver ( or 1st time consumer of anything). You can talk to them until your blue in the face about the merits of each product but it has 0 meaning without knowing the what the range of value is. It's often times easier to know what ALL of the "bells and whistles" are so you can decide what you do and don't need. I've never liked being told arbitrarily "you're a beginner... you don't need that".

Kind of like shopping for a car. You always end up test driving the "loaded" version and then decide for your self whether or not you really need/want the heated steering wheel and navigation system.
 
Dang,

Everyone be cool... :)

Mels, there was no need for anything to turn ugly, and in fact, all I see here is good discussion about the merits of buying top gear for a newbie diver. Paul seemed to get very defensive (maybe warranted maybe not) because some people felt you might have been being upsold unnecessarily. There were some things of great importance iommited from the original post and that skewed the responses from the participants.

I think the meat of the matter boils down to two things.

1. That the inexperienced buyer practice due diligence in comparison shopping so that they understand not only the prices of items they are choosing, but the VALUE of the items they are choosing.

2. That the LDS practice good sales and disclose a range of options for the purchaser especially when the buyer is new to the sport.

The original post led us to believe that neither had happened, when later on it appears that at least one if not both of these steps was taken. This SIGNIFICANLY impacts the range of opinion, at least from this poster.

If the buyer is aware that lower cost options would also suit the need, but decides independently to purchase more expensive, and clearly excellent gear, then better for them and for the dive store. If the dive store explains the merits of each system clearly for the buyer, then that dive store deserves the good reputation that it has. Apparently around the area, Paul's store earns that reputation and I say good for him.

When I first certified, I went to both my local dive stores. The first was the shop where I certified, and I bought all my skin gear from them. It was a pretty fly-by-seat-of-the-pants deal. When I went to the other shop, money in hand, the manager asked me if I could be patient while he finished up a sale and then would help me. I waited, and then he put EVERY BC he had in my size on me, explained the features and merits of each. Then explained every regulator he had in the store in a similar fashion. I spent nearly $1k that weekend with him because the service was outstanding. There was no internet SCUBA sales back then, so LDS's only competed with each other.

Mels, it appears Paul has a good shop with a good reputation. If you are comfortable with the gear you were offered, and the price, then by all means, buy from there. The support of a local shop is invaluable. The LDS I use now has a special section for Tech divers. I told the owner yesterday that the reason I spend money in his store is because he caters to tech divers, and hires divers who understand the gear and can give qualified advice. It's hard to get that over the internet.

Paul, I'm sorry we jumped the gun on you. Really no harm was meant by me, and I doubt by anyone else here. As a communty I think people tend to be overprotective of those new to the sport and that might have been the case here. Hopefully Mels will become a loyal customer, and hopefully she will give you an opportunity for her business.

'Nuff said.
 
I don't live in Boston but it sure sounds like Pgdive is handling this in a great way. I am also new to diving and am glad to hear what kind of service can be expected from a good LDS. Giving options and information and letting the individual decide sure sounds good to me. Thanks Mels2 for posting the question and thanks Pgdive for being willing to explain your thoughts. Like you I would like to buy from a LDS and I am willing to pay more for GOOD advice and GOOD service. This thread is helping me know what that means.
 
I think most of us were trying to prevent the newb from being ripped off that happens so much. I to like to support my LDS but when it comes to $400 in the pocket or supporting my LDS..sorry but I have to go with the $400. That is a lot of extra dive gear in any bodies gear bag.
 
I've been following this post... and just want to chime in that with the gear they are talking about... no way they could cut the price in half. Could they maybe save a few bucks... perhaps. Could they get buy with some stuff that is a bit cheaper... sure.

Really when it comes to buying stuff though, I normally explain to people - no matter what you buy, you're going to be upset. If you buy the best of the best, you'll be upset because you spent so much money. If you buy the cheapest stuff, you'll be upset because you're not happy with the quality. If you buy something in the middle - you'll be pissed off for both reasons! So just decide why you want to be upset!

I don't think there is anything wrong with selling someone top notch gear. And buying before you have a lot of experience... I really that is up to the individual. My brother bought a Mooney Airplane before he finished his pilots license.

And saying someone could get by with cheaper stuff based on their diving... maybe true... But I drive a 4 wheel drive Z71 Avalance... I could get by with 2 wheel drive. I could skip the leather... why not just a stripped pickup... Cause I wanted it, I can afford it and I appreciate the quality. It makes me feel good to own it, and comfortable when I drive it. Was the guy who sold it to me wrong?? I don't think so.

Really based on the responses from the shop here, I'd probably say that if all the stores out there gave the customers as many choices and this much service - our shop would not be as big as it is. Is the shop going to make a few bucks here?? Sure.. nobody works for free... And if the customers feel they are getting value, and they like their selections - they are not going wrong.

Sure they could chase around, shop about, look for used, buy elsewhere, and any of those could save them a few hundred or so... but did they gain value from doing that. I have nothing against a LDS... I am one! I'm against stores that pressure sell customers based on a limited stock of and the "This is the best.. (cause it's all we carry) mentality, instead of educating them on their options and letting them make informed decisions based on product, quality, service and selection... and in this case - I'm sure the customers realize they could save $400 or so per package if they hunted - but if the rest of the offers from the shop and the personal time they get from the sales people warrants that, I would not criticise their buying decision.
 
ty all for your imput, we actually did go on saturday and picked our gear. We picked on our needs and wants not price. Still trying suits but Genevieve and Paul will be helping me get a suit that fits me right. Hopefully this will be a short time period so we can get to the main objective and thats getting in the water.
 
scubatoys:
My brother bought a Mooney Airplane before he finished his pilots license.

bassird...

i mean... great...
 
mels_2:
ty all for your imput, we actually did go on saturday and picked our gear. We picked on our needs and wants not price. Still trying suits but Genevieve and Paul will be helping me get a suit that fits me right. Hopefully this will be a short time period so we can get to the main objective and thats getting in the water.

AWESOME! Glad to hear you went into the shop as a more informed buyer, and put your money down with what seems to be a good LDS. Better around for everyone.

Happy diving!
 
PerroneFord:
Does the water dictate an 8mm semi-dry suit? I don't know, maybe the water temps there are in the 40s all the time.

You obviously haven't been to New England! It's sweltering hot* here right now, in the high 80's. The entire town was down at the pond the past few days to cool off. My wife and I decided to take our snorkel gear and search the swimming area for lost Rolexes, etc. When we hit the thermocline at about 5 feet it was like being physically assaulted with a deep-frozen halibut. Keep in mind, this is mid-June in a small pond. Water around here is COLD and stays that way year-round, except right at the surface. My personal belief is that anyone who dives in New England in anything less than 7mm is asking for it. That would be for June-August. The rest of the year I'd vote drysuit.

*Yes, I know. I moved here from the Gulf Coast. However, these Yankees don't seem to have heard of air conditioning. In any event, the guy who built my house in 1790 decided not to install any.
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/peregrine/

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