Primary Reg hose Ruptured at 110 feet.

[drbill]

Agree on the possibility that a swivel is another failure point, especially some of the "less expensive" ones I've seen out there. The great thing is that your primary equipment, your brain, didn't fail and you didn't panic. Given that you learned something very important about yourself underwater. Glad everyone came up OK.

 

[MikeFerrara]

Agree on the possibility that a swivel is another failure point, especially some of the "less expensive" ones I've seen out there. The great thing is that your primary equipment, your brain, didn't fail and you didn't panic. Given that you learned something very important about yourself underwater. Glad everyone came up OK.

While there may not have been "panic" I'd say there was a failure in that they were blown off the wreck and the team was seperated during the handling of the initial problem. Luckily the third team mate didn't have a problem too and there was another team around for her to join...and luckily the boat found them ok and they were in good enough shape that they could wait the 15 minutes. Lots of luck there but the idea is to handle these things in a way that STOPS the cascade of problems that sometimes leads to injury or worse. While everything turned out ok, the follow up problems that can follow from the original were NOT avoided in this case. the cascade was survived but not stopped.

 

[Doc Intrepid]

We too have been going slowly. Gradually a bit deeper each dive. Ironically, this was our last step.This is as deep as either of us really ever plan to go. We just wanted to have some referance for the narcosis. The one diver is an instructor, but this wasn't a "class". My GF and I planned the dive. He reviewed it and agreed with what we were going to do, based on what we've done in the past. (We've dove with him around a dozen dives, including these succesively deeper depths.)

You done good!

You can certainly be excused for getting swept off the objective by strong current while dealing with issues. (Lessons learned about strong currents and need for clear communications as well as swivels!)

More than one diver has wrestled with a question like "leave wreck to follow swept off buddy(s) or stick with wreck?" Its no fun, and your gf likely has her own lessons learned.

Adventures are how we gain experience. Things will continue to happen down there, its how you deal with them that counts. Good choice on having a more experienced diver down there with you. While you (and others) can always second guess your actions, it appears to me that your response was effective.

In the unsolicited advice category:
* Learn how to turn on and off your own tank valve underwater. Pretty important.
* Keep on debriefing after dives, e.g. need signal clarification re: whether to call a dive based on <whatever> condition...
* Lose the swivels.

Thanks for sharing.

Doc

 

[jwvanno]

While there may not have been "panic" I'd say there was a failure in that they were blown off the wreck and the team was seperated during the handling of the initial problem. Luckily the third team mate didn't have a problem too and there was another team around for her to join...and luckily the boat found them ok and they were in good enough shape that they could wait the 15 minutes. Lots of luck there but the idea is to handle these things in a way that STOPS the cascade of problems that sometimes leads to injury or worse. While everything turned out ok, the follow up problems that can follow from the original were NOT avoided in this case. the cascade was survived but not stopped.

Mike, I appreciate your hard, objective look at the situation and your statement that the chain of events should have been stopped.

I'll learn from that statement.

It just happened so FAST! I think I mentioned that the two data points, 20 seconds apart, from the log show 1768lbs then 29 lbs and an ascent from 111 at the first point to 78 at the next. The third point shows -29lbs and a depth of 65 feet. We'd recovered bouyancy and self control within 40 seconds.

We were still on the wreck for the regulator exchange. And during the 10-15 seconds that we were whited out from the bubbles, I actually believed we were still on the wreck up until the bubbles cleared and I could look around for my second buddy. That's when I knew we'd been blown off. I'm sure we were both breathing much deeper than normal which made us bouyant, then we stuck our heads into the current, and position keeping failed.

With the exception of the missing buddy, I am now happier that we left the wreck, then trying to ascend the anchor line. A full 1/2 of my experience has been drift dives in the gulf stream current, and this was actually the first anchor line descent I'd ever done. I'm trying to imagine adding that new task of ascending a line with that ripping current into the mix of what happened. At least when we were drifting, I was in an environment that was totally familiar. (Except for the REQUIRED buddy breathing part!! )

But I can fully understand the point of trying to break a chain of events, and will certainly begin trying to preplan problems better with an eye towards: If this happens, do this first.

I'll also practice shutting off my own valve multiple times on the next dive's saftey stop!

I'm sure experience will help...

 

[MikeFerrara]

With the exception of the missing buddy, I am now happier that we left the wreck, then trying to ascend the anchor line. A full 1/2 of my experience has been drift dives in the gulf stream current, and this was actually the first anchor line descent I'd ever done. I'm trying to imagine adding that new task of ascending a line with that ripping current into the mix of what happened. At least when we were drifting, I was in an environment that was totally familiar. (Except for the REQUIRED buddy breathing part!! )

Good point. In some places drifting descents and ascents aren't practical but they sure are more comfortable. There's nothing fun about being whipped around on a line like a flag on a flag pole. LOL

 

[Iruka]

Of course it's good to be able to turn your valve off (or on!) underwater...but the first priority would be to get to your buddy's alternate. Don't turn off your air before you get there, ha ha. Also, depending on arm length, wetsuit thickness, etc, it can be difficult to reach that valve over your shoulder (practice will let you know for YOU, personally)....so if your buddy is able to do it for you, I don't see a problem with that....unless, of course, they never think to do it. Who knows, maybe he/she might LIKE the jacuzzi.....

 

[diverbrian]

Of course it's good to be able to turn your valve off (or on!) underwater...but the first priority would be to get to your buddy's alternate. Don't turn off your air before you get there, ha ha. Also, depending on arm length, wetsuit thickness, etc, it can be difficult to reach that valve over your shoulder (practice will let you know for YOU, personally)....so if your buddy is able to do it for you, I don't see a problem with that....unless, of course, they never think to do it. Who knows, maybe he/she might LIKE the jacuzzi.....

Of course, there is the theory that if you can turn it off yourself, you can feather the valve and conserve your air. Personally, I agree with the idea that I am looking for another source of breathing gas before I shut mine off.

But, it was demonstrated here that the bubbles can make it sort of difficult to see where you are at. That can create its own problems.

Not all things are cut and dried and there is really no such thing as a perfectly handled "incident". Just some are handled better than others. All are a learning experience. It sounds to me like the divers involved did most of the right things. I have read too many accounts of situations that started with far less of a problem turning into far more .

 

[Doc Harry]

Glad you're okay.

I had a similar experience at 80 feet, but I didn't have a swivel. The failure point was where my primary regulator and hose connected.

It's pretty distracting to have a free-flowing regulator in your face, isn't it?

My buddy was right there. I just breathed from my free-flowing reg until it ran out. Didn't even think about feathering the valve since I wasn't very deep. Switched to my buddy's secondary reg and we completed the dive normally.

Since then, I do "rock-bottom" calculations on all of my dives. And I'm switching to DIN valves for more security, don't like the thought of bumping my yoke valves on some rock or a beam.

The possibility of "catastrophic gas loss" became a reality and I'm better prepared now!

 

[Taipeidiver]

I had a similar situation when one of my buddies had his tank o-ring pop at around 30m, also in current, I handed him my alternate, shut down his valve to conserve whatever was left in his tank, and we made a normal ascent together.

At the time I had about 60 dives and my buddy was a trimix instructor with several thousand dives to his credit.

What is interesting is the point you make about positional awareness; by the time we had all the gas management under control we were way off the site. Shooting a bag whilst air sharing is a challenging procedure and I guess that whilst focusing on that task we were just carried away by the current.

Thank goodness we were sharing on alternates and not buddy breathing or who knows what might have happened.

My key lesson from your experience is to practice emergency drills regularly, especially OOA drills but also valve shutdowns (if you dive doubles, I am not sure I want to shut down my own tank on singles unless I know where the next lungful is coming from!), and anything else you might be able to think of.

Cheers,
TD

 

[discrepancy]

Of course, there is the theory that if you can turn it off yourself, you can feather the valve and conserve your air.

That's a great idea. I will try in the shallows soon. I wonder if things really turned to custard, and you closed off your tank valve until it was almost shut, you might be able to whack your own alternate in your mouth and breathe from the airflow still coming through, and then with the reduced flow you might be able to kink the busted low-pressure hose like a garden hose?