This.
Preventing Harness Webbing Wear
- Thread starter divezonescuba
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This.
What's a DPS?
My litmus test is does the idea meet Hogarthian minmalism? If not then it does not pass muster. Not just the bolts and screws but all of the other kludge I see people add to their rigs that they justify by personal preference. Personal preference in itself does not fit with Hog minimalism. All of the plastic buckles because we cannot get our arms in the loops, extra D-rings all over, retractors and all manner of crazy stuff passes by on these threads. I think, like, well, if BHM had designed a single tank open water rig, what would it be? Since he did not, I just apply as close to the same thinking for my rigs as was used to develop the cave rigs he helped to author (other people contributed, perhaps even more so).
I know the OP and he is a really nice and smart fellow (perhaps too smart
) but I ain't going to be using bolts to prevent harness chaffing. Just let it chaff, does not hurt a thing. I have another known dive friend who kludges up his rig to the point I have to just look the other way. He has multiple angle adapters, zip ties, bolts and rivets drilled into his webbing to secure them, D-rings all over and each with some sort of gizmo hanging from them. My OCD gets the better of me sometimes and then I just step on my tongue and shut up. He is also one of the most skilled divers I have met. What is with this concern over harness wear? I like my jeans worn, looks right with my boots, if my scuba harness has some wear, it just makes it look authentic, like worn jeans with cowboy boots. That is how it supposed to be. It does not need to be fixed 
.
I know the OP and he is a really nice and smart fellow (perhaps too smart
) but I ain't going to be using bolts to prevent harness chaffing. Just let it chaff, does not hurt a thing. I have another known dive friend who kludges up his rig to the point I have to just look the other way. He has multiple angle adapters, zip ties, bolts and rivets drilled into his webbing to secure them, D-rings all over and each with some sort of gizmo hanging from them. My OCD gets the better of me sometimes and then I just step on my tongue and shut up. He is also one of the most skilled divers I have met. What is with this concern over harness wear? I like my jeans worn, looks right with my boots, if my scuba harness has some wear, it just makes it look authentic, like worn jeans with cowboy boots. That is how it supposed to be. It does not need to be fixed .
Dive planning software like MultiDeco, Baltic, Abysner, DecoPlanner, etc.
I know Chris means well but some of his posts take fertile but untrained minds on distracting and unhelpful detours.
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None of us were born certified, but knowing where you are the dunning-kruger curve via some level of self-awareness is pretty key for those actively teaching.
Had to look this up....very esoteric
: "The Dunning-Kruger curve illustrates a cognitive bias where people with low ability or knowledge in a particular domain tend to overestimate their own competence. It’s named after psychologists David Dunning and Justin Kruger, who first described the phenomenon in 1999."Not certain how this was applied to the topic at hand; aimed at student or instructor or both.....will inject my 2psi [stolen term] worth....everyone thinks they are the real deal and others not so much....training and system edicts are not necessarily the 'best above the rest' as they hype...truly each diver is responsible for filtering through cognitive bias presented in the instruction...not popular today, but ultimately the individual is responsible for their own development and safety....what constitutes 'distracting and unhelpful detours' is highly subjective and what works for one diver in a specific situation may be totally wrong for another...but we seem to be devolving into a lock step, our way or the highway rigidity in what is presented as the safest diving practices and equipment...
I am not knocking any of the initialed programs that are so prolific; nor any views in this thread....but once in the water the diver's safety is entirely their purview and depends more on judgement that gear or what certifications/training cards in their wallet....cognitive bias? Of course all of us have biases but they may or may not be detrimental and certainly are not something for another to adjudge about us....learned biases are precognitive awareness and can save our butt.
Damn, said to myself that I would not get sucked into this but here I am. Old mossback that I am, I still believe that in the end experience and water time is the best teacher and that we instructors are at our best when we lead by example. Nobody has the keys to the kingdom and one size does not fit all in selection or configuration of gear, methods of instruction or diving protocols...we all have a lot we can learn from others.
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We've been talking about Dunning-Kruger and "mount stupid" on this board for a very long time, at least 15+ years. Check out the extensive threads about Doc Deep's fatal dive for some sad examples of wildly overestimating your own knowledge when someone's basically a novice and just doesnt realize it.
Actually cutting a one piece harness to "avoid wear" would have Bill Main rolling more than his eyes.
Actually cutting a one piece harness to "avoid wear" would have Bill Main rolling more than his eyes.
Ok thanks for the info....have not been on the forum that long to read about that incident....no lack of mistakes that have caused injury or death....but the OP's cutting the harness [not what I would do] is not in my view something that would raise to a "Mount Stupid" event; no more than cutting a sacred HOG rig to install buckles on shoulder straps [again, not what I would do]....
Guess what trying to convey is "to each their own" if not your cup-of-tea then don't do 'it'; but let others make decisions based on their own judgment without judging them or the presenter....OP has produced a prodigious number of videos, an accomplishment in and of itself....no penalty for not emulating him.....darn, Rodney would be disappointed that we can't seem to get along with divergent opinions. Also I bet B.M would have been tolerant of differing designs and approaches to problem solving; really doubt he thought the HOG 'everything' was an altar and could not be changed.
Again, appreciate your input and views, not dismissing them but trying to glean something of value for me.
No. Instructors are responsible for their students. Not just for safety during training dives, but for setting them on the right path to continued learning. The trouble is that most prospective students, even those with some recreational dive experience, lack a framework and judgment for identifying incompetent and dangerous technical diving instructors. The unlucky ones waste a fortune learning bad habits which take twice as long to fix later (assuming they survive). The rest of us who've been doing this stuff for a while need to take responsibility for the interests of the dive community as a whole and look out for the newbies.
I'm all for learning from diverse perspectives but we have nothing to learn from the likes of @divezonescuba. In writing there is the concept of poetic license: a skilled writer can intentionally break the conventional rules of spelling, grammar, and style to achieve a desired effect. But you have to know the rules before you can break them. You have to pass kindergarten first. This guy is unclear on the basics that he should have learned in an entry level course. He's not coming up with anything new, he's simply ignorant about the history of technical diving and is rehashing bad ideas that were tried and rejected by better divers decades ago. The adults in the room here are not impressed.
Instructors without a doubt have an obligation to keep their divers safe during training and hopefully after training. BUT my divers remain safe over the years due to their acceptance of their own safety. The skills and judgements that keep them safe are 'home grown' and are entirely on them to correctly exercise. They must be able to discern what works and what does not for them. We launch them and they sustain their own safety. Individual accountability make not be in vogue, but once underwater that is all that counts.....
Yes, I have what in my opinion encountered unsafe diving practices in instruction; but the concept of wasting a fortune [irrelevant] is not in the mix nor are any of us so spot on that we can assume the role knowing it all....no two students have the same instructional needs....
I do see a disconnect, Technical Diving is not anything special; but keeps being held up as the gold standard of diver safety. The basic physics and physiology apply to all divers and to elevate one "system" of diving with a litany of equipment do's and don't as the exemplar for all divers really short changes all divers. There is not one system to rule them all.
To say that the OP is ignorant and is rehashing bad ideas seem very, very myopic to me. I don't have to agree with anyone's position or concepts but showing them respect in the discourse is my responsibility.
What happened to the tenet that we can agree to disagree?
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