Possibly moving to Puerto Rico

[grouchyturtle]

Seems I've been asking this one a lot lately...so here we go again!

I'm a full time live aboard/cruiser, who's looking to move out of the US in the not too distant future. Based on some of the responses I've been getting in other groups and forums, it seems like someplace that's a US territory would be my best bet. My plan for wherever I end up is to try charting my boat.

Just looking for suggestions on locations to move to?
Any info on what the tourism and charter business is like down there?
What it would take to start a business down there?
Cost of living?
What's the diving like?

Anything you can help out with, or any websites you could direct me to that may have this info would be great.

 

[Hank49]

I've heard a lot of good things about Panama. Retirement and business friendly. No hurricanes. Pacific and Caribbean spearfishing.....why am I in Belize?

 

[grouchyturtle]

Seems I'm starting to have a constant growing and shrinking list.

Belize was pretty high until your response to my other post. Also heard there's a fair amount of red tape to move there, and they're good at losing paperwork.

Right now USVI's are on top, either St. Thomas or St. Croix.

I saw Tortola mentioned on another site. But considering it's only 10 miles from St. Thomas, and from what I've heard BVI's are more expensive then USVIs, I don't see the point in moving there over a US territory, which would be easier.

I've also heard Grenada has one of the most open door policies down there. And it's far South, so it's a pretty safe spot for hurricane season. Just not sure what it would take to work there.

 

[Mark Derail]

I was in PR in 2006 and loved it. I plan on going there in March 2012.

US currency, their "president" is like a governor. If you are a US citizen, there is no problem "moving" there. I know a couple from Maine that moved there, bought a sailboat and do tours. I brought them maple sirup from Quebec as a tip.

NO SALES TAX, one of the lowest income tax levels. Very high police presence. 99% Spanish, most police officers I talked to, younger than me, didn't know English. Being French, I was able to get by. What's nice is that you feel like you're in another country. Lots of things to visit for tourists.

PR has come around a lot in the last 50 years, the middle class is booming. The kids are all being educated.

It's also home base for Bacardi...I extensively visited San Juan and East of there along the coast. The Rio Grande area is nice.


Having visited Maui, HI, and also PR and Cozumel, the "cost of living" is quite different. I doubt you'd easily get permits to operate in Mexico, the cheapest cost of living. However PR is much cheaper than the Hawaiian islands.

Want to know a big, growing industry? Medical tourism. Us divers need dental work done too.

Since you "run" a liveaboard, you should check out what the dive shops up North are "selling". Usually it's trips to the Bahamas or the Caymens. I feel that PR is left out, yet, has beautiful beaches and diving.

 

[irmo]

No president, only the Governor. Puerto Ricans are US citizens, so yes if you're a US citizen its like moving between two states...just go. Puerto Ricans do not pay federal income taxes (territory, not a state), but I don't know how that applies to someone moving from a state to PR. Once you're a resident, do you not pay federal income taxes any more until you move back? I have no idea, but its worth checking out. I have to disagree with the previous poster, PR income taxes are pretty high. They start at 7% and go to 33% for upper income levels. Most states highest rate is around 7%. Again, the trade of may be no federal taxes.

There are a number of charters run out of Fajardo. They are busy at Christmas time when I visit, but I don't know about the rest of the year. You can look at the tourism magazine called "Que Pasa" on line and see some of their ads. Maybe if you contact some of them they can give you a rough idea of the year round business case.

I would also disagree on language. I've been going to PR for 27 years (also stay in Rio Grande), my wife's family is from PR so we visit every year. Nearly everyone speaks English to varying degrees, with a very high percentage fluent (or nearly).
I do agree with the previous post regarding beautiful beaches and diving. Also, the people are great...loads of fun. I'd move there in a heartbeat, but need a job.

 

[Mark Derail]

Thanks IRMO !!!

Rates in Canada are much higher - I meant to say - and so PR is cheaper than Canada (except maybe Alberta), because we have to pay Provincial & Federal.
Both combined I pay over 51% in Quebec.

Funny about the police & spanish, out of at least 10 officers I talked to (hey, I like talking!) less than half understood English, and they were young (below 30) which surprised me.
However in various stores in Rio Grande, and restaurants, English was very well understood everywhere.

Little things like out in the country, putting gas, at pump #5, I said "pump 5" and wasn't understood. Then I switched to French and said "Pompe cinq" and she said the gas $ in Spanish (almost identical to French), and we got along fine.

Then again, travel outside of Montreal in Quebec, and 99% only speak French. Part of it is "la fierté de la langue"; you are proud of your language and speak it first, even though I was visibly a "gringo". Many places in Quebec do the same, French first.

IRMO, will you be in PR the first week of March 2012? I might be going down, stay at a friend's condo in Rio Grande (near the golf course).

No president, only the Governor...They start at 7% and go to 33% for upper income levels. Most states highest rate is around 7%.

 

[irmo]

Hi Mark. 51%, ouch. Now I know why the US govt is so far in debt, our taxes aren't high enough. Oh wait... I take it back! I take it back!

That is funny about the police...maybe they didn't feel like talking and it was easier to say "no entiendo"? I'm surprised so many didn't understand english at all. You're right though, the farther you get out of the cities, the less fluently english is understood. Being a total gringo myself, my spanish is only marginal (yes, even after 27 years), but I get by easily, particularly when my live in translator does the talking. We're going down at Christmas so probably won't be back in March. I'm guessing your condos are on the grounds of the Rio Mar if you're near the golf course. We stay in the next group of condos down the beach to the west. The condos are called Playa Yunque. I love it there. At Christmas, if there are 8 other people on the beach with us, that's a crowded day. Of course most self respecting puerto ricans don't go to the beach in the winter, it's too cold; what with the air temps in the 90s F and the water dipping all the way down into the mid 80s F. Enjoy your trip! Maybe if grunzster has set up shop you can go diving.

By the way grunzster: the web site for Que Pasa is ¡Qué Pasa! click on the "look inside" menu item to look at a .pdf of the current issue.

 

[grouchyturtle]

Thanks guys! It's really starting to look like PR or USVIs are going to be my best bet. I don't run a live aboard. I AM live aboard. Going to be doing just day trips, and not necessarily diving. But either way my USCG license will be good. Mexico requires a minimum of 500 ton license just to operate in the country.

Maybe work in St. Thomas, STX, or PR for the season, and run to Grenada for hurricane season?

 

[jlevine]

I have gone to PR yearly for the past six years for diving so I'll offer my perspective. I love the island and have had a great time each year. Nice people. Great food. Incredibly diverse terrain. Good infrastructure for banking. The US dollar is the currency. US car insurance often covers American drivers. Reasonably good healthcare. Oh yes...I love the diving too! Given that PR is a US commonwealth, you have no problems going there and working legally. There are a lot of positives.

Having said that, I think there are some realities that need to be grasped. It is important to remember that the PR economy is not doing well at all. There are a high percentage of people (40% at one point) on federal assistance. Jobs are scarce. On the one hand you have a large number of Puerto Ricans who have college degrees. Unfortunately, the jobs aren't there to support them. Consequently, many PR natives move to the US mainland (hence the term "New Yoricans"). Governor Fortuno (can't type the tilde over the n) is trying to shrink the government and shift job creation back to the private sector. There is somewhat of a brain drain. In terms of tourism, for whatever reason, PR does not seem to market itself as well as other Caribbean locations. I live in California and have seen a few commercials...very few. Puerto Rico is often a transit point for tourists going to other islands. Cruises start in San Juan and go elsewhere. I know PR is working aggressively towards improving its marketing but there is still work to be done.

In terms of English, I somewhat agree with Irmo who posted above but differ in other areas. The number of people who know English will depend on the area, a person's age, and a person's education. Also, knowing the language and being willing to speak it are two different things. I speak a reasonable amount of Spanish and can get by. It always helps if you demonstrate a willingness to try. If you go to areas like San Juan, Rincon or Culebra which have more US mainlanders and professionals, you will see and hear a lot more English. If you are in a more remote area, it's different. If you are speaking with a high school or college student, they will likely know some English, but not necessarily be fluent. College students in PR are often required to know English - but again the level may vary. Older people may not know English as well. I once went into Plaza Las Americas (the largest shopping mall in the Caribbean) and stopped at a kiosk and asked the vendor a question. She was in her 20s and did not speak English. I went to Borders books (sad to see it go) and all the staff were fluent in English. It just varies. By the way, I hope I didn't offend anyone with those statements. Just my observations.

If you go to Puerto Rico to start a business, I suggest doing the basics. Come up with a business plan, identify your prospects, and then devise ways to draw revenue.

Again, I love the island. It is a jewel in so many ways.

 

[Mark Derail]

Thanks jlevine.

Up here in Canada, specifically Ontario & Quebec, Cuba is getting progressively more & more bad reviews, I know a few people that went & got sick, others that have gone 20+ times and never sick. However the standards seem to be lowering, everyone expecting tips all the time.

I'm thinking of setting up a business of some sort in PR, because
1) such a great place
2) great climate
3) educated people
4) low cost of living

As a Canadian, I cannot legally live in the US for more than 6 months, EVER. Immigration to the US is closed to Canadians. You either have to get a specialty job, keep it for 3 years, with the special visa. Or.
Start a business with employees.

Most states this is 5 people minimum, over a 3 year period minimum.
Famous Canadian singers, actors, they create a "Fan Club" in the US, and similar rules in other countries. That's how Celine Dion (example) gets to choose where to live. She simply buys / invests in a business. Though she can't vote for a US president.
​

I'm planning a trip out in March 2012, and will be looking into diving also.

With such a bad economy throughout the US, it's unfortunate, but it's to my advantage. I was there in March 2006, and 300,000$ condos selling in Loiza, Viesques, Luquillo were simply NOT selling. A Remax agent was stating that I could offer 220k on a 300k asking and just might sell.

I'm sure it's gotten worse. In different areas of Florida, far away from Orlando, 200k condos are selling at 30k, however the monthly condo fees are the same.

So I have two choices. Setup a business in PR or FL. I prefer PR !!!!!!!!!