Poseidon Atmospheric Full Face Mask
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FFMDiver
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Its a "no frills" mask. Very industrial type. It comes with the poseidon jetstream which has a needle valve at the diaphram. I'm still adjusting the tube with an allen wrench and twisting toward the diaphram to increase the flow from my 1st stage aqualung. MUCH easier to clear than the ocean reef and a much better seal. Also, much more rugged. Be prepared to pay through the nose but its probably the best on the market - although AGA users will argue differently (primarily because it was based on the AGA). No matter how you sclice it, these masks were designed from inexpensive HAZMAT respirators. They slapped a reg on them and charge $600 - $700.
Bmuise,
Don't take this wrong, but, I'm not sure where youre getting you information, but the AGA (Divator MKII) mask was originally designed as a diving mask in the 1950's and adapted to SCBA applications later. The AGA reg, now the Divator was one of the first single hose regulators designed and has evolved into what it is today. The Ocean Greef mask was a filter mask, but not the AGA. There has been a filter mask that was an offshoot of the Divator, but not the other way around. The Divator FFM was designed with the reg as a system. It has features that are unique to the FFM design. The Divator still has, IMHO, the best design. One is the regulator, it can be maintained without the use of ANY tools (by someone that's trained) in minutes. I'm talking about complete disassembly and reassembly. It has an adjustable pushpad for equalizing. Note that the Poseidon doesn't. You have to cut it to lower it and it's already as high as it will go. A design flaw. There may be an issue with the oral nasal and clearing a flooded mask, I have to try it yet though, just an observation with the design. The reg sits lower and farther from the chin than the Divator. In all, I'm not saying it's a bad mask, I still have to dive the one I have in my office. I do like the attachments of the head harness to the skirt and the shape of the visor, although the visor is thinner than the Divator as are the straps. The Poseidon also comes in two sizes, necessary for those with narrower faces or smaller in stature. One comment someone made, that the demand setting of the reg was difficult to breath. That shouldn't be. And the adjustment of the first stage? Why so touchy? The Divator will operate with an IP of 90 to 170 psi, although I recommend between 125 and 145 with little or no adjustment necessary. When you get down to it, you have the same with the Poseidon as with the OR mask, it started out as a mask for other applications, then had a reg modified to fit. Although Poseidon is a heck of a lot closer to the bullseye than Ocean Reef. Then there's the price, the Divator starts retail at $499 plus $50 for the hose or a swivel. Again, that's retail. The price goes up to $650 depending on color and regulator (positive pressure or demand). No need for positive pressure in the vast majority of applications.
Now, congrats on getting over the Ocean Reef mask.
Padiuk, in a conversation with a friend of mine at Poseidon, there was a mention of fitting another one of the Poseidon regs to the mask. I don't recall which or why. Probably better sticking with the Jetstream. The work has already been done to adapt that reg to the mask. I'd also recommend buying the mask with the reg. Don't bother with the retro for a Jetstream if you already own one.
Don't take this wrong, but, I'm not sure where youre getting you information, but the AGA (Divator MKII) mask was originally designed as a diving mask in the 1950's and adapted to SCBA applications later. The AGA reg, now the Divator was one of the first single hose regulators designed and has evolved into what it is today. The Ocean Greef mask was a filter mask, but not the AGA. There has been a filter mask that was an offshoot of the Divator, but not the other way around. The Divator FFM was designed with the reg as a system. It has features that are unique to the FFM design. The Divator still has, IMHO, the best design. One is the regulator, it can be maintained without the use of ANY tools (by someone that's trained) in minutes. I'm talking about complete disassembly and reassembly. It has an adjustable pushpad for equalizing. Note that the Poseidon doesn't. You have to cut it to lower it and it's already as high as it will go. A design flaw. There may be an issue with the oral nasal and clearing a flooded mask, I have to try it yet though, just an observation with the design. The reg sits lower and farther from the chin than the Divator. In all, I'm not saying it's a bad mask, I still have to dive the one I have in my office. I do like the attachments of the head harness to the skirt and the shape of the visor, although the visor is thinner than the Divator as are the straps. The Poseidon also comes in two sizes, necessary for those with narrower faces or smaller in stature. One comment someone made, that the demand setting of the reg was difficult to breath. That shouldn't be. And the adjustment of the first stage? Why so touchy? The Divator will operate with an IP of 90 to 170 psi, although I recommend between 125 and 145 with little or no adjustment necessary. When you get down to it, you have the same with the Poseidon as with the OR mask, it started out as a mask for other applications, then had a reg modified to fit. Although Poseidon is a heck of a lot closer to the bullseye than Ocean Reef. Then there's the price, the Divator starts retail at $499 plus $50 for the hose or a swivel. Again, that's retail. The price goes up to $650 depending on color and regulator (positive pressure or demand). No need for positive pressure in the vast majority of applications.
Now, congrats on getting over the Ocean Reef mask.
Padiuk, in a conversation with a friend of mine at Poseidon, there was a mention of fitting another one of the Poseidon regs to the mask. I don't recall which or why. Probably better sticking with the Jetstream. The work has already been done to adapt that reg to the mask. I'd also recommend buying the mask with the reg. Don't bother with the retro for a Jetstream if you already own one.
FFMDiver
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Thats a fair assessment. I dont know anything about AGAs - just what I've read on this forum. Poseidon seems to have a great reputation and is why I choose it.
I can tell you that if you take an MSHA full face respirator and place it next to a Poseidon you wont find many differences in the rubber portions. My jetstream is a little fussy to adjust. I'm waiting to get home and strap it to my tank to do some real adjusting. I do feel much better having the Poseidon over the Ocean Greef. But the OR had more vis. Would love to try out a Diveator - looks hot. My credit card has taken a severe beating after purchasing the OR and the Poseidon.
Perhaps I really want to avoid the "which is better AGA or Poseidon" argument.
I can tell you that if you take an MSHA full face respirator and place it next to a Poseidon you wont find many differences in the rubber portions. My jetstream is a little fussy to adjust. I'm waiting to get home and strap it to my tank to do some real adjusting. I do feel much better having the Poseidon over the Ocean Greef. But the OR had more vis. Would love to try out a Diveator - looks hot. My credit card has taken a severe beating after purchasing the OR and the Poseidon.
Perhaps I really want to avoid the "which is better AGA or Poseidon" argument.
TX65
Contributor
The talk that is out there is someone may be able to fit the Xtreme regulator to the Atmosphere, although the Jetstream that is with the Atmosphere has the sleeve and servo from the Xtreme so what would be the point. I asked Viking about this rumor and they said they knew nothing of it. The Jetstream in the Atmosphere has molded in tabs for mounting in the Atmosphere.
As far as the overbottom pressure, Poseidon quotes a recommended over bottom pressure which is inline with their 1st stages. If a non-poseidon 1st stage cant be adjusted that high, then someone will loose performance on deeper dives.. The same hold true for the AGA and DSI EXO and M48 pod thing. Typically, FFM demand equipment requires an overbottom pressure from 90-180 psi depending on depth. Remember, Poseidon tests their regs deep and will quote things for that use.
Note,,,the Poseidon is not a redesign of some gas mask or something for other purposes with a regulator modified to fit it. The same engineers who designed the last version of the AGA designed the Atmosphere incorporating Poseidon's 2nd stage which is still considered one of the best in world. The only changes to the Jetstream are incorporation of the Xtreme servo and sleave to allow for Postive Pressure and Demand switching.
FFMDiver
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So, for anyone interested in purchasing the Poseidon Atmosphere and wants optimal performance, expect to pay:
$265 Odin 1st stage
$47 Yoke Adaptor
$750 for the Mask
-----------------------
$1012
This does not include required Poseidon octo (because higher IPs will probably blow rings out of recreation octos...)
Probably explains why divers consider the Jetstream finicky to tune because they're always tuning them to recreational 1st stages. In the computer world this is known as "proprietory conflict."
Can anyone tell me if AGA has these same compatability problems? :wacko: :wacko:
$265 Odin 1st stage
$47 Yoke Adaptor
$750 for the Mask
-----------------------
$1012
This does not include required Poseidon octo (because higher IPs will probably blow rings out of recreation octos...)
Probably explains why divers consider the Jetstream finicky to tune because they're always tuning them to recreational 1st stages. In the computer world this is known as "proprietory conflict."
Can anyone tell me if AGA has these same compatability problems? :wacko: :wacko:
TX65
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There are multiple 1st stages on the market that can be tuned for higher output pressures. As a cost control, many scuba regulators dont have the adjustment needed for full face masks.
As an example, Kirby Morgan sells a Superflow 1st stage that is designed for use with full face masks and demand helmets. As an example, Kirby Morgan 2nd stages on their masks and helmets require between 115 and 225 PSI over ambient pressure with the amount of pressure varying based on depth.
I double checked on the Poseidon and it requires 138 PSI over ambient at 167 fsw. Any full face mask will operate at lower then optimum pressures and at depths under 100 fsw, should not create a problem. As depth increases, breathing resistance will increase.
The real question becomes, what over bottom pressure does your 1st stage max at and how deep are you going to use the FFM? The answer to part 1 will tell you how deep part 2 should be.
The old Poseidon US Distributor used to include the yoke adapter and viton o-rings on every regulator set that was sold. This served no purpose other then to increase the cost of the regulators placing them out of the range of alot of people - It added about $100 to the cost of a regulator.
Typically, even people with multiple Poseidons only need 1 yoke adapter for those times they werent diving DIN. It stinks having a box full of $47 adapters that are seldom used.
Today, Viking is distributing regulators without the yoke and viton o-rings to keep costs in line for a wider range of divers who dont use Nitrox over 40%. The yoke adapter is available for people who need that feature.
As an example, Kirby Morgan sells a Superflow 1st stage that is designed for use with full face masks and demand helmets. As an example, Kirby Morgan 2nd stages on their masks and helmets require between 115 and 225 PSI over ambient pressure with the amount of pressure varying based on depth.
I double checked on the Poseidon and it requires 138 PSI over ambient at 167 fsw. Any full face mask will operate at lower then optimum pressures and at depths under 100 fsw, should not create a problem. As depth increases, breathing resistance will increase.
The real question becomes, what over bottom pressure does your 1st stage max at and how deep are you going to use the FFM? The answer to part 1 will tell you how deep part 2 should be.
The old Poseidon US Distributor used to include the yoke adapter and viton o-rings on every regulator set that was sold. This served no purpose other then to increase the cost of the regulators placing them out of the range of alot of people - It added about $100 to the cost of a regulator.
Typically, even people with multiple Poseidons only need 1 yoke adapter for those times they werent diving DIN. It stinks having a box full of $47 adapters that are seldom used.
Today, Viking is distributing regulators without the yoke and viton o-rings to keep costs in line for a wider range of divers who dont use Nitrox over 40%. The yoke adapter is available for people who need that feature.
FFMDiver
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I'm certainly not knocking the engineering behind Poseidon.
I suspect they sell mainly to professional divers and to those who
take sport diving to a new level. Commercial divers can afford to have employers purchase high-end masks in bulk. I'm sure cities and county FDs get great deals on multiple purchases.
I'm simply here to present the true costs involved for the person who is thinking about stepping up to a higher-grade mask.
I suspect they sell mainly to professional divers and to those who
take sport diving to a new level. Commercial divers can afford to have employers purchase high-end masks in bulk. I'm sure cities and county FDs get great deals on multiple purchases.
I'm simply here to present the true costs involved for the person who is thinking about stepping up to a higher-grade mask.
nyresq
Contributor
Probably explains why divers consider the Jetstream finicky to tune because they're always tuning them to recreational 1st stages. In the computer world this is known as "proprietory conflict."
Can anyone tell me if AGA has these same compatability problems?
The AGA in a positive pressure configuration requires a high flow, but not a high intermediate pressure. I have used them on only diaphragm first stages (poseidon and oceanic). All of my regs are tuned to about 135 psi. I tried my AGA on a deco reg that was an unbalanced piston detuned to about 115 psi and if I started breathing hard the flow wasn't enough to keep up.
I don't how a demand type AGA would do or how it will flow from a high performance piston. but as far as pressure its fine at 135 psi.
Don't know what interspiro reccomends for the AGA as far as IP but I've dove mine to 145 feet and never had a problem.
Can anyone tell me if AGA has these same compatability problems?
The AGA in a positive pressure configuration requires a high flow, but not a high intermediate pressure. I have used them on only diaphragm first stages (poseidon and oceanic). All of my regs are tuned to about 135 psi. I tried my AGA on a deco reg that was an unbalanced piston detuned to about 115 psi and if I started breathing hard the flow wasn't enough to keep up.
I don't how a demand type AGA would do or how it will flow from a high performance piston. but as far as pressure its fine at 135 psi.
Don't know what interspiro reccomends for the AGA as far as IP but I've dove mine to 145 feet and never had a problem.
"Note,,,the Poseidon is not a redesign of some gas mask or something for other purposes with a regulator modified to fit it. The same engineers who designed the last version of the AGA designed the Atmosphere incorporating Poseidon's 2nd stage which is still considered one of the best in world. The only changes to the Jetstream are incorporation of the Xtreme servo and sleave to allow for Postive Pressure and Demand switching."
TX, Actually the skirt for the Poseidon has been around for around about five years or so. The manufacturer visited with several different companies to propose having it built into a diving mask, Poseidon was the first to bite and did adapt the Jetstream to the skirt. The Jetstream wasn't designed to the mask, nor the mask to the Jetstream, the reg was re-engineered to the mask and a little visa versa. Aqualung is, or was, (typical Aqualung) also working on a FFM using the same skirt and adapting one of their regs to it. To my understanding they were/are having a more difficult time working out the gas flow for the visor/oral nasal. I haven't talked to anyone lately to see if they're still doing anything with it. Poseidon doesn't manufacture the skirt, frame, oral nasal or visor assemblies. They do manufacture the vent assembly and the adaption of the Jetstream to the mask. The skirt came along before Poseidon got a hold of it.
There's a fair amount more to the story, but, this is the Reader's Digest version.
And you're right, the Jetstream is a fine reg, ranks right up there with the Divator.
As far as compatability, you do want to use a high performance first stage on the Divator (AGA), but it'll work with about any of them. I've used them with Poseidon, Apeks and Zeagle's with no trouble whatsoever...
TX, Actually the skirt for the Poseidon has been around for around about five years or so. The manufacturer visited with several different companies to propose having it built into a diving mask, Poseidon was the first to bite and did adapt the Jetstream to the skirt. The Jetstream wasn't designed to the mask, nor the mask to the Jetstream, the reg was re-engineered to the mask and a little visa versa. Aqualung is, or was, (typical Aqualung) also working on a FFM using the same skirt and adapting one of their regs to it. To my understanding they were/are having a more difficult time working out the gas flow for the visor/oral nasal. I haven't talked to anyone lately to see if they're still doing anything with it. Poseidon doesn't manufacture the skirt, frame, oral nasal or visor assemblies. They do manufacture the vent assembly and the adaption of the Jetstream to the mask. The skirt came along before Poseidon got a hold of it.
There's a fair amount more to the story, but, this is the Reader's Digest version.
And you're right, the Jetstream is a fine reg, ranks right up there with the Divator.
As far as compatability, you do want to use a high performance first stage on the Divator (AGA), but it'll work with about any of them. I've used them with Poseidon, Apeks and Zeagle's with no trouble whatsoever...
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