Pony Bottle / Stage Bottle / Decompression Bottle. What's the difference?

[johndiver999]

@johndiver999 how is that outside of the typical recreational diving parameters? Thousands of recreational divers do that dive every season in NC with nothing more than an AOW card.

Also, while you should launch an SMB as soon as it happens, it may be half an hour before the boat can actually start moving to go get you. They have to wait for all divers to get back on board, and manually get unhooked from the wreck since they are tied in vs. an anchor that you can haul up. All of that takes time before they can move and depending on sea conditions and surface current, you may well be a long way away. Sure they're going to find you, but it will be rather unpleasant until they do.

All of that to justify not carrying a sufficiently large bottle that you could have traversed back to the anchor line. I don't understand why people continue to defend inadequate gas reserves. Plan for the worst, hope for the best. If you're going to carry a pony instead of doubles, the difference between a 19 and a 40 is not enough to start defending inadequate reserves.

Perhaps they might consider having a dingy to chase divers or a floatball to attach to their tie in, so that they can provide assistance to a diver that needs it?

Also, I don't see what difference it would make if they were tied in or anchored, other than trying to move, unhook and haul up an anchor while divers are in the water is a worse choice. Anchored or tied in - doesn't seem to make any difference?

 

[rjack321]

Sorry to hear about all those dead divers. Were they doing recreational dives? Why were they not able to ascend in a controlled manner?

OOA, narced in the dark, scrambling for octos or really gas at all. Then running out of air again on the ascent breathing heavy and embolizing. These are just 4 I know of locally.

You seem very hung up on the math that 13cf "should" work. The reality is that everything has to work perfectly - an extra minute on the bottom and a consumption rate of 1.25cf/min and you're probably not going to make it. Basically circumstances have to be perfect for 13cf to work out, how many OOAs happen in perfect conditions?

 

[johndiver999]

OOA, narced in the dark, scrambling for octos or really gas at all. Then running out of air again on the ascent breathing heavy and embolizing. These are just 4 I know of locally.

You seem very hung up on the math that 13cf "should" work. The reality is that everything has to work perfectly - an extra minute on the bottom and a consumption rate of 1.25cf/min and you're probably not going to make it. Basically circumstances have to be perfect for 13cf to work out, how many OOAs happen in perfect conditions?

Sounds like a terrible situation. Sorry to hear about that.

 

[tbone1004]

Perhaps they might consider having a dingy to chase divers or a floatball to attach to their tie in, so that they can provide assistance to a diver that needs it?

Also, I don't see what difference it would make if they were tied in or anchored, other than trying to move, unhook and haul up an anchor while divers are in the water is a worse choice. Anchored or tied in - doesn't seem to make any difference?

When anchored, as soon as the last diver is on board, they can start the engines and start hauling the anchor. When tied in, they have to send a diver down, untie the anchor line, then get him back on boat, then start the engines. Takes quite a bit more time.

The boats do all have a floatball, but that implies you come up close enough to the boat to grab it. Dinghy is not going to happen. I'm curious why you are advocating for all of that for the boat to accommodate instead of the diver bringing adequate gas reserves with them though.

 

[johndiver999]

When anchored, as soon as the last diver is on board, they can start the engines and start hauling the anchor. When tied in, they have to send a diver down, untie the anchor line, then get him back on boat, then start the engines. Takes quite a bit more time.

The boats do all have a floatball, but that implies you come up close enough to the boat to grab it. Dinghy is not going to happen. I'm curious why you are advocating for all of that for the boat to accommodate instead of the diver bringing adequate gas reserves with them though.

I'm all for divers having enough gas to make it back safe.

As for the boat issues, I probably was not clear. There is no need to haul up an anchor or send a diver down to a mooring in a minor emergency. The boat can just untie from the anchor or mooring line and leave a large float ball on the end - and then go chase down the person who needs help. The divers who remain on the wreck, should be able to ascend up the anchor/mooring line and when reaching the surface they can try to hang on near the float or (more likely) drift off.

 

[broncobowsher]

When in FL doing the Oriskany there was instructions on if you come up the anchor and there is no boat not to worry. If they need to chase a diver blown off the wreck they leave the anchor line on a buoy. Go chase down the problem. come back and tie back in. It is possible to do it without a chase boat.

You could send some people down with an 80 for a pony and it still wouldn't be enough for them. somebody will still find a way to screw it up.

 

[RyanT]

The boat can just untie from the anchor or mooring line and leave a large float ball on the end - and then go chase down the person who needs help.

Actually they can't. They may very well have divers transitioning onto the 15' hang line. Some of those divers may be rather poor divers that have an unplanned deco obligation and/or be out of air and hanging on the boat's emergency supply. I've seen that happen more than once in NC.

 

[johndiver999]

Actually they can't. They may very well have divers transitioning onto the 15' hang line. Some of those divers may be rather poor divers that have an unplanned deco obligation and/or be out of air and hanging on the boat's emergency supply. I've seen that happen more than once in NC.

LOL, you mean to tell me the boat is doing special "accommodation" for divers who don't carry enough gas to complete a dive safely?

Seriously though, that would be a problem. You might be able to throw the tank that supplies the emergency gas on the line/buoy as well, but now we are getting into a pretty complicated situation NOT recreational.

 

[tursiops]

LOL, you mean to tell me the boat is doing special "accommodation" for divers who don't carry enough gas to complete a dive safely?

Yes, that is pretty standard. Maybe you need more and varied experience?

 

[johndiver999]

Yes, that is pretty standard. Maybe you need more and varied experience?

I agree, I sometimes invest a lot of effort in pursuing new experiences.