PADI not teaching dive tables anymore?

[ScottyK]

Thanks for the replies.

Scott- Appreciate the alteration, but what I was told by the store employee was accurately quoted by me. She failed to mention that it was thier choice to not teach them. She also said nothing about computer training or eRDP tables.

Let me alter my question somewhat.

Does every PADI OW student walk out of class receive training in the math of how the tables work, whether on a blackboard or electronically?

 

[theduckguru]

Since the profit goal of an LDS during training is to sell the student gear, dumping tables = increaded profit.

 

[boulderjohn]

Thanks for the replies.

Scott- Appreciate the alteration, but what I was told by the store employee was accurately quoted by me. She failed to mention that it was thier choice to not teach them. She also said nothing about computer training or eRDP tables.

Let me alter my question somewhat.

Does every PADI OW student walk out of class receive training in the math of how the tables work, whether on a blackboard or electronically?

I don't understand the question. The only math in using tables is early elementary level addition. If students are never going to use tables, why should they be trained to use them? If they are going to be using computers, why shouldn't they be trained to use them?

 

[RJP]

Note, driving schools no longer teach hand turn signals either.

:d

 

[drrich2]

Teaching computers makes more sense for more people.

Many OW students rely on computers or follow a guide around on tropical charter boat trips on vacation; neither use tables to plan dives.

Tables are quite conservative since they're based on square profile dives with a pre-planned depth. Many tropical coral reef divers dive multi-level dives with considerable leeway in depths chosen on-the-fly during the dive (in other words, most of the depth might be around 40 feet on a reef in Bonaire, but if you see a big sea turtle or spiny lobster, you might swoop down 20 feet for a closer look.

Richard.

 

[UWRCN]

So if everybody is all for ditching tables or any form of deco theory. Tell divers just do what the computer tells you. What's next? Assembly of dive gear can be taken out. Most divers are warm water vacation divers and the dm will assembly all the gear and change tanks.

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[ScottyK]

I don't understand the question. The only math in using tables is early elementary level addition. If students are never going to use tables, why should they be trained to use them? If they are going to be using computers, why shouldn't they be trained to use them?

Where did I say that you shouldn't know how to use your computer? You should understand how tables work for the same reason that you carry a spare light, or back up a wireless transmitter with a small SPG clipped off on your BC.

When I get a dive briefing, I check the tables against the stated depth of the dive so I have a good idea of what my bottom time should be. Then I look at my watch on the downline and have an idea in my brain (i.e. the backup to my computer) as to what time I need to be back at my safety stop. If PADI is not teaching tables anymore, where is the backup and/or double check against what the computer is telling you? Several have said the the computer training is "very comprehensive". I'm trying to get a more specific answer as to what that entails.

---------- Post added January 26th, 2013 at 10:38 PM ----------

Note, driving schools no longer teach hand turn signals either.

:d

Great metaphor. Really shining a spotight on your IQ..... See, I can be funny too

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Not in my classes. I'll continue to teach tables. Recommend new divers try to work on their buoyancy and trim by doing square profiles planned on the tables regardless of what they see below them, develop the discipline to stick to dive plans they make, and once they do this then think about getting a computer. Then use the computer to augment those plans, but never substitute flying the computer for them. They will be taught to always have some method of knowing their time and max depth for that time when, not if, the computer fails. And to expect that it will.

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[drrich2]

So if everybody is all for ditching tables or any form of deco theory. Tell divers just do what the computer tells you.

If PADI is not teaching tables anymore, where is the backup and/or double check against what the computer is telling you?

People have blindly followed tables as much as they have blindly followed computers, knowing about as little 'deco. theory' either way. Just because somebody learned the tables well enough to get past the written test during OW doesn't mean they made the effort to retain a working knowledge of the tables, or use them.

I did my class room OW work in late '05, got OW cert. in '06, and we did do tables. We also did tables when I got nitrox cert.'d not long after, so I've done tables, and I've used computers.

I've yet to hear of a case where a computer gave bad NDL limits causing a problem that tables couldn't, but if you really want a backup, you can wear a backup dive computer (which a number of people do).

After all, if you used tables, would you use different tables by a different company (NAUI in addition to PADI, perhaps?) as a backup to generate a 2'nd opinion?

Richard.

 

[Dr Dive]

Dr Dive sez: Fine idea to teach computer use exclusively, but I have 2 real world concerns from numerous dive deck observations: what does the table ignorant diver do when they try to turn the computer on, and it fails? Sure, they are supposed to check it pre-dive, but sometimes they just don't work. With no backup, tables or RDP, they have to not dive, depend on a table knowledgeable diver to help, or "share" computers with somebody. What does the nitrogen loaded diver, whose computer fails on the surface interval do? Without some manual back-up (tables don't run on batteries), the computer dependent diver is helpless, and totally dependent, on the knowledge and good graces of a better prepared diver or boat crew. Fact is computers are great, but they fail. You need a back-up plan, and "hoping for the best" won't cut it.
Just my $0.02 from the dive deck.
Y'all come see us.
Capt. Jim
Dr Dive