OW Dives for Certification

[geogator]

I have a question for the instructors out there. I was talking with 2 friends who are certified (1 a few years ago & 1 within the last year) about their OW checkout experiences. My friend who was certified a while ago said that he did a total of 4 checkout dives (2 in one spring on one day, 2 in a different spring on day 2.) My other buddy did his course from a different dive shop in another area of the state & did 2 dives in a single spring on day one & spent day 2 diving Rainbow River (a long drift dive). I said that I was under the impression that PADI required 4 separate OW dives to be certified & he responded that his instructor considered the Rainbow drift as 2 separate dives because even though the total river time was about 90 minutes, they stopped in a shallow area for about 15-20 minutes halfway down the river to discuss skills, what was next, etc. Is there a hard/fast rule on the number of dives required for OW certification & just what constitutes a "dive" in this case?

Thanks for any input you can give me.

 

[a22shady]

There has to be 4 OW dives. I believe each dive has certain requirements. In order to be counted it must be atleast 20min long with a Surface interval to discuss the dive before/after. I am sure an Instructor will come by and add the exact's in here.

 

[Torben]

"During open water dives, have divers spend the majority
of time at 5 metres/15 feet or greater, and breathe at least
1400 litres or 50 cubic feet of compressed gas or remain
submerged for at least 20 minutes." - Padi instructor manual.

It do not have any requirement to length of surface interval. So it seems to be okay with a 15-20 minutes break, but it needs to be logged as two dives, and the skills needs to be performed.

 

[tac747]

I am not an instructor and am also new but by what you posted the river run was "technically" 2 dives with a 15-20 minute surface interval. Like I said I am not a pro but thats the way I see it. I do have 1 question. Can you do the required skill tests on a drift? correct me if I am wrong as I want to learn.

 

[popje]

I have a question for the instructors out there. I was talking with 2 friends who are certified (1 a few years ago & 1 within the last year) about their OW checkout experiences. My friend who was certified a while ago said that he did a total of 4 checkout dives (2 in one spring on one day, 2 in a different spring on day 2.) My other buddy did his course from a different dive shop in another area of the state & did 2 dives in a single spring on day one & spent day 2 diving Rainbow River (a long drift dive). I said that I was under the impression that PADI required 4 separate OW dives to be certified & he responded that his instructor considered the Rainbow drift as 2 separate dives because even though the total river time was about 90 minutes, they stopped in a shallow area for about 15-20 minutes halfway down the river to discuss skills, what was next, etc. Is there a hard/fast rule on the number of dives required for OW certification & just what constitutes a "dive" in this case?

Thanks for any input you can give me.

7. Conduct skills outlined in the course instructor guide
and include:
a. Briefi ng covering dive objective, safety and care for
the environment.
b. Equipment assembly and predive safety check
c. Entry
d. Exit
e. Debriefi ng and equipment disassembly
f. Logging the dive – sign each student diver’s log book.

NB: point d. The Instructor Manual is extremely long and I really don't like the online version... So pardon me if I'm a little too lazy to go find every quote pertaining to this point. But as far as I can recall, the student needs to exit the water and change his tank in order in order for it to be considered a separate dive whether or not which or what skills were completed. I know that it's not always necessary to have an extended surface interval, however, I would not consider it prudent to pop up from 1 dive, "chat" a little and proceed with the next one.

 

[popje]

I am not an instructor and am also new but by what you posted the river run was "technically" 2 dives with a 15-20 minute surface interval. Like I said I am not a pro but thats the way I see it. I do have 1 question. Can you do the required skill tests on a drift? correct me if I am wrong as I want to learn.

Depending on which skills you're talking about. Some can be, some are better done stationary.

 

[Lead_carrier]

I am not an instructor and am also new but by what you posted the river run was "technically" 2 dives with a 15-20 minute surface interval. Like I said I am not a pro but thats the way I see it. I do have 1 question. Can you do the required skill tests on a drift? correct me if I am wrong as I want to learn.

A lot depends on the agency. I believe I'm correct that PADI requires skills to be done on the 4th dive. SSI and I believe NAUI don't, the 4th dive is an excursion dive. As long as I have control of the diver doing the skill then, in my opinion, there is nothing wrong with doing some of the skills while drifting or swimming. Isn't that where I'll be when I actually need to perform the skill?

 

[Kingpatzer]

Within PADI it is required that there be 4 checkout dives conducted over a course of at least 2 different days. Dive 1 is an orientation dive, while dives 2-4 have skills that are required to be performed on each dive. Each dive has defined skills that must be completed as well as a few skills that can be scheduled for any of dives 2-4. Within PADI for there to be 2 separate dives, the students must exist the water, disassemble their gear, debrief the dive, assemble the gear for the next dive, and enter the water. If they did not exist, disassemble and reassemble the gear, then they violated standards if it is a PADI course.

 

[Scott]

Dive 3 Performance Requirements
At the surface:
1. Plan dive with dive computer or RDP.
2. Put on and adjust equipment.
3. Perform a predive safety check.
4. Adjust weighting.
Underwater:
5. Descend using a visual reference for control to 6-9
metres/20-30 feet. Use the five-point method.
6. Become neutrally buoyant by inflating the BCD orally.
7. Clear a fully flooded mask.
Open Water Diver Course
8. Explore the dive site.
9. Ascend no faster than 18 metres/60 feet per minute
while maintaining buddy contact. Use the five-point
method.

From GS&P page19

7. Conduct skills outlined in the course instructor guide
and include:
a. Briefing covering dive objective, safety and care for
the environment.
b. Equipment assembly and predive safety check
c. Entry
d. Exit
e. Debriefing and equipment disassembly
f. Logging the dive – sign each student diver’s log book.

One could argue that an entry on dive 3 and exit on dive 4 could satisfy the requirement

 

[Kingpatzer]

From GS&P page19


One could argue that an entry on dive 3 and exit on dive 4 could satisfy the requirement

You'll lose that argument. I am aware of a shop near me that used to do their "surface interval" floating above their platform to avoid a surface swim. They had a long talk with PADI after they found out about the practice. The students must exit the water.