Opinions on new divers with technical setups?

[Badger W.]

It really just feels like the biggest difference with the long hose is knowing to A) check it isn’t tangled when you start and route it and B) just lower your head and pull it off to donate...

I feel like if I were ever in the situation of needing to share air in my current setup I’d struggle to find the octo immediately and default to buddy breathing until both second stages are sorted anyway.

my bad. Struggle isn’t the right word, but in a situation where my buddy is out of gas id wanna handle that immediately with primary donate and then work out the back-up situation. I’ll stuff the octo in my waist band sometimes or my D-ring other times. I know I should be consistent, but it floats away or shifts sometimes.

 

[doctormike]

exactly. After all the research and topics and vids and opinions I’ve been looking at over the past year, it really just seems to make more sense to do the hogarthian style setup.

I was just worried about having to defend that decision to people that really know their stuff. Maybe I’ve been on SB too long. Thanks

I'm serious. Other than possibly the weight issues with air travel, I can't think of a single advantage of a traditional jacket BC over a BP/W. There are a million threads on that here, and I don't really need to go over all of those arguments again. But that design was built on hard earned experience.

The standard Jacket BC is vastly more common in recreational diving for a number of reasons that have nothing to do with the diving experience (rental inventory, no need for first time adjustments, and marketing stuff). And the vast majority of recreational divers train in this gear, so that becomes the norm.

I mean, I'm not saying that people shouldn't dive in whatever they like, but if they are willing to consider a system that they may not have had experience with before, there are a lot of advantages. I am super comfortable with a BP/W in on a single tank, bathing suit only, Caribbean dive. Just feels right.

Not sure who you would have to defend the decision to. A technical diver who saw a newbie in a BP/W would likely be impressed, if anything.

 

[doctormike]

Nothing at all wrong with that. Better to learn to dive with the correct gear from the start. I would suggest a 5’ hose for the primary on single tank dives. It’s a little easier to deal with on a boat.

Exactly. 5' vs 7' kind of depends on how tall you are, though. I find a 5' hose a bit tight with my single tank rig (6'2"). The main thing is a bolt snap near the second stage, to keep the reg safe when you aren't diving.

 

[doctormike]

my bad. Struggle isn’t the right word, but in a situation where my buddy is out of gas id wanna handle that immediately with primary donate and then work out the back-up situation. I’ll stuff the octo in my waist band sometimes or my D-ring other times. I know I should be consistent, but it floats away or shifts sometimes.

Exactly. Not to duplicate the MANY threads on this here, but the advantage of primary donate is that the gas recipient is probably in near panic, while the gas donor has been breathing normally. So the one thing you need to do is IMMEDIATELY plug that person into a reg that you KNOW is working.

The donor can wait a minute or so to find a reg, the recipient can't. And you know that your primary is working. If a panicked recipient takes an octopus and gets a mouthful of water, sand or no gas, it's not going to end well. If your octopus is dead, you at least have a little while to calm your new best friend down to the point that they will be wiling to buddy breathe, if that's absolutely necessary.

 

[bradymsu]

I was just worried about having to defend that decision to people that really know their stuff. Maybe I’ve been on SB too long. Thanks

You won't have that issue from experienced technical divers at dive sites. Just the opposite. Most will respect you for having a backplate, wing, harness, and Hogarthian setup rather than a standard recreational BCD. Just keep in mind that you need to have the appropriate wings and hose lengths for a single tank, which will be different than for doubles or sidemount. Knowing what I know now, if I were to start from scratch, I'd start sidemount even if it's with two smaller tanks. I suspect it could be the wave of the future for recreational diving.

As for ScubaBoard, don't worry too much about what people say on here. Of the very critical ones, most are just repeating things they've read from others rather than wisdom acquired from experience diving. It's not uncommon to see critical comments from American technical divers on here challenged by European divers who have far more actual dive experience.

 

[napDiver]

Although the #1 rule of diving is to be cool. Don't worry about what other people think. They probably dive worst then you when you were taking your OW class.

As long as it allows you to dive safely, you are fine. If you don't dive the normal recreational setup, I recommend you give all your new dive buddies a heads up pre-dive... This is how I donate. This is how you get me out of my gear. Here is where you dump my weights or you cannot dump any of my weights.

Happy Diving

 

[Caveeagle]

As for ScubaBoard, don't worry too much about what people say on here. Of the very critical ones, most are just repeating things they've read from others rather than wisdom acquired from experience diving. It's not uncommon to see critical comments from American technical divers on here challenged by European divers who have far more actual dive experience.

Not sure why you seem to be making this an “US vs Europe” thing.. but I know there are several US based divers here that are probably doing 2-5+ technical dives in a typical week.. so if you were poking at someone specific.. it sure seemed like too much of a general snipe.

 

[Badger W.]

I'm serious. Other than possibly the weight issues with air travel, I can't think of a single advantage of a traditional jacket BC over a BP/W. There are a million threads on that here, and I don't really need to go over all of those arguments again. But that design was built on hard earned experience.

The standard Jacket BC is vastly more common in recreational diving for a number of reasons that have nothing to do with the diving experience (rental inventory, no need for first time adjustments, and marketing stuff). And the vast majority of recreational divers train in this gear, so that becomes the norm.

I mean, I'm not saying that people shouldn't dive in whatever they like, but if they are willing to consider a system that they may not have had experience with before, there are a lot of advantages. I am super comfortable with a BP/W in on a single tank, bathing suit only, Caribbean dive. Just feels right.

Not sure who you would have to defend the decision to. A technical diver who saw a newbie in a BP/W would likely be impressed, if anything.

Although the #1 rule of diving is to be cool. Don't worry about what other people think. They probably dive worst then you when you were taking your OW class.

As long as it allows you to dive safely, you are fine. If you don't dive the normal recreational setup, I recommend you give all your new dive buddies a heads up pre-dive... This is how I donate. This is how you get me out of my gear. Here is where you dump my weights or you cannot dump any of my weights.

Happy Diving

Solid advice. Thank you

 

[Badger W.]

Exactly. 5' vs 7' kind of depends on how tall you are, though. I find a 5' hose a bit tight with my single tank rig (6'2"). The main thing is a bolt snap near the second stage, to keep the reg safe when you aren't diving.

6’3 here, looking at a 60 inch primary

I need a dive with my buddy to let the webbing stretch and re adjust my new setup for BP/W anyway, so it’s a great chance for us to practice donate, mask removal, buoyancy, etc.

 

[Badger W.]

Exactly. Not to duplicate the MANY threads on this here, but the advantage of primary donate is that the gas recipient is probably in near panic, while the gas donor has been breathing normally. So the one thing you need to do is IMMEDIATELY plug that person into a reg that you KNOW is working.

The donor can wait a minute or so to find a reg, the recipient can't. And you know that your primary is working. If a panicked recipient takes an octopus and gets a mouthful of water, sand or no gas, it's not going to end well. If your octopus is dead, you at least have a little while to calm your new best friend down to the point that they will be wiling to buddy breathe, if that's absolutely necessary.

Thanks for the advice. I literally just pulled the trigger on the purchase. Thanks to everyone else commenting as well.