Online dealers - random question

[redacted]

A few words of caution, their warranty in't always what its cracked up to be. Many of these online stores and auction houses don't even service gear and probably don't even dive. Buying from an authorized dealer and registering your product means you get the best warranty and are kept aware of recalls which do happen.

Yep. Years ago when I bought a couple new Scubapro Mk20/S600 I spent at least 5 minutes deciding to buy from other than USA authorized sources and save about 40% off the USA authorized dealer prices. That is a pretty expensive warranty for something that is quite reliable.

RE: The overseas market: Be aware that MOST equipment is manufactured overseas, but when manufactured for the US market, may be manufactured to a higher standards.

Or it may be a lower standard. Or a different standard. Or, in most cases, the exact same standard. Few. if any, major pieces of gear in the USA do not carry the "CE" label.

 

[EastcoastdiverLLC]

Was just throwing out a thought... The equipment I sell is priced just about as low as I can go but as a business and not an individual diver, I can't afford to sell anything that would be questionable. I don't have that luxury. I am familiar with only US standards and we/I am in the US. Certainly, reliable equipment can be had in other markets, but the question seemed to be aimed at business, sales.

Gary

 

[Coalcracker]

I suspect the few who seem to have had some success, like Atomic, have done it with more recent and carefully crafted contracts and probably some attractive incentives to voluntarily not sell to grey market dealers at heavily discounted prices.

Seems like most/all atomic products are in stock at leisure pro. I doubt atomic is any different than the others who lie and deny.

Just buy the gear that suits your needs at the price that makes sense to you.

Those who really believe the whole gray market bs, and they are not authorized dealer scheme, can go on and on with that sad charade.

Next time you are in New York check out Leisure Pro they have it all without any attitude.

 

[h90]

Mike, I agree with you mostly but I'm not sure about this European sourcing theory. I suspect that all the grey stuff comes from regular US manufacturers. I've never seen a reg or comp with different "batteries"? You kidding right? 220 or 240 or 110V, I can understand. Even 50 or 60 Hz. Transformers are global , so who cares. But different batteries??? Manuals are typically produced in 4-7 languages so that they can be sold globally. Have you really seen one sold here or is this just conjecture?

A friend always bought mobile phones in china (a few years ago). You got exactly the same much cheaper. You only needed to change the language or in some cases flash them new.
On his last patch, 200 phones they (I think it was nokia) had only "simplified chinese" on a Read Only memory. In Germany you might sell two pcs to your Chinese restaurant Owner.......
But on dive equipment there is nothing country specific, maybe bar-psi, meters but not much more

 

[tridacna]

here's an example of LP's statement on their manuals might not come with US manual.

Warranty Policy | LeisurePro.com

Warranty Policy

Leisure Pro buyers find the best products at the lowest possible prices wherever they are. Since (sometimes) that means that we do not buy it directly from the manufacturer, nor are we authorized by them to sell their products, so we are not bound by the official/unofficial manufacturer's suggested retail prices, and we can pass on the tremendous savings to you. In some instances the product will come without an English language manual or manufacturer's warrantee cards valid in the United States. In those cases, we provide our own Leisure Pro Warranty, which offers equal or greater protection.
​

I suspect that this may have more to do with shielding the original manufacturer than anything else. There is no way that Oceanic is going to make a VEO with a different battery to accommodate Euro users. So case closed there. I think that this is a game played between LP and the manufacturers. The "missing warranty" etc is just to confuse us.

I've bought many many items from LP. I've yet to uncover a device that could not be serviced anywhere. Heck, Atomics make a HUGE stink about where you buy their gear (Super Duper Offical Stores Only), but you can buy it from LP and get it serviced at any dealer. I have. The hype is just that: Total BS.

 

[vondo]

Grey Market dealers also buy stuff overseas in bulk. So your regulator or computer might be let's say a European model and come with slightly different battery or a manual in a different language. The scuba industry isn't the only industry that does this. It's much more rampant in the photo equipment industry.

Which I never quite understand. In the photo market, take a look at B&H's prices and the Gray Market is clearly marked and maybe 3% cheaper on pro-level gear. The only thing I can think of is that the U.S. warranty isn't good for commercial use so companies are buying these to save just a tiny bit of money. I certainly wouldn't consider it.

Now 40% on a regulator, I'd consider. 40% on a pair of fins, no question there.

 

[Marek K]

I actually think there may be something to the notion that LP gets at least some of their inventory from Europe.

I ordered an Oceanic Veo 180 computer from them last year, and it came with the operator's manual in Spanish only. May have been for the Latin American market; but I'd somehow expect English too in that case.

I suspect Spain.

I e-mailed LP, and they apologized and promptly sent me a English-language manual.

--Marek

 

[tridacna]

I actually think there may be something to the notion that LP gets at least some of their inventory from Europe.

I ordered an Oceanic Veo 180 computer from them last year, and it came with the operator's manual in Spanish only. May have been for the Latin American market; but I'd somehow expect English too in that case.

I suspect Spain.

I e-mailed LP, and they apologized and promptly sent me a English-language manual.

--Marek

True. But is there any difference in the actual computer sold to you and that sold in the US? Does anyone seriously think that Oceanic has two manufacturing facilities. One for the US and one for the rest of the world. Obviously not.

Bottom line. You can choose to spend a lot more by buying from an Authorised store or buy it online and save $. (Heck, someone has to pay full retail list price!).

ps Doesn't Latin American Spanish differ from Castillian Spanish? Couldn't a native language reader tell the difference? I strongly suspect that you are correct in your guess.

 

[Marek K]

But is there any difference in the actual computer sold to you and that sold in the US?

Not that I can tell. I know, that was a rhetorical question.

Does anyone seriously think that Oceanic has two manufacturing facilities. One for the US and one for the rest of the world. Obviously not.

Not me. I was just saying that LP probably uses a whole lot of different sources for their products. Overseas vendors... yes, even dealers going out of business... and I don't doubt that manufacturers sell stuff to them direct too...

Brett is probably reading these posts, and laughing...

Doesn't Latin American Spanish differ from Castillian Spanish? Couldn't a native language reader tell the difference? I strongly suspect that you are correct in your guess.

Spanish isn't one of my languages. Significant enough to be able to tell from a user's manual?

--Marek

 

[DA Aquamaster]

Doesn't Latin American Spanish differ from Castillian Spanish? Couldn't a native language reader tell the difference? I strongly suspect that you are correct in your guess.

Spanish is also in the same family as Italian and I have to look at a sentence or two to tell them apart for sure.

That said, I have "English" manuals that were quite obviously badly translated from Chinese or Japanese and if the same thing occured, I doubt that a native Spanish speaking person could tell if the target language was Castillian/Iberian Penninsular or Latin American Spanish since some examples are close to gibberish anyway.

With my limited 25 year old and little used Spanish minor language skills I can't really tell one from the other in writing, but the difference is more in terms of formailty and is very evident when spoken. Castillian Spanish is (or at least was) most often taught at the high school and college level in the US and many students noticed the difference very quickly when they took trips to Mexico or central america where what they hear is much more contracted and coming at them about three times faster than they can decode and process.