Observations during gf's cert. class
- Thread starter RedCash02
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Basic Course, structure, price and continuance regarding the expansion of knowledge is consumer dictated, so if you want more do more.
Fore-go the Kevlar reg and titanium bc buy something normal and spend cash on getting trained or diving or all four.
If you want something structured differently from what is demanded, then considered sub par, or information almost completely for free, go to a soup kitchen.
Dumbed down is is a ridiculous and demeaning reflection raising doubt in new people with some possibly questioning the quality of their courses as opposed to themselves who are usually the ones that fail to identify that once they may have been that person.
If we concentrate on progression, rather than the harking back to the fantastical olden days when everything must have been more comprehensive but done the same, last year, or forty years ago, when we were the new ones looking ahead at describing the future new ones from a perspective of which we had little understanding due to learning something which was once inconceivable or being dumb, then that is the course to take, the course for the future.
I can't remember which agency I certified with or the detail of how, and nor can my instructor, we have regular contact, but that was 1976.
But we do remember mostly, what we are doing today and how that will affect today and what we do tomorrow.
There once was a time not long ago from different spectrum's where astronauts and aquanauts were held in a varying awe
I still have that awe.
Beware the curse of the knowone Thanks
fresh_fish
Contributor
I was certified in 2007. It is very disheartening to hear they are not teaching tables anymore. I still do not have a computer, and I dive (and know) the tables. I have been trying to save up for a computer, but I'd rather spend the money diving. It's not right to require it. Plan your dive, dive your plan, and you're all wet!!!
dburg30
Contributor
PADI OW back in June and all we did was tables.
I did my OW class just over 2 years ago and we were taught to use the eRDP, mainly because that's what came in our crew packs, though I do have a set of (non-waterproof) tables in my logbook. I taught myself how to use tables about 4 years ago from a book (getting certified wasn't a feasible option at the time) but our instructor went over how to read them in AOW for some reason or other. There was ZERO mention of computers, and the only thing in the book about front inflate bcs was that they exist but aren't used much anymore. (It also mentions bp/w type BCs)
We used AL80s in the pool and open water, but I had done a Discover Scuba with the same shop using 63s in the pool. I can understand using 63s in pool sessions cause you just don't need that much gas, but not during checkout-dives where the extra stress of a new environment, wetsuits and possibly a bit of "test" nerves will have the students going through air more quickly.
Maybe I was lucky, but for my class, we had 4 students with an instructor and a DM (he may have also been an instructor, dunno) and i think 18 with 2 instructors and a DM for open water (i would have prefered fewer people for that though)
We used AL80s in the pool and open water, but I had done a Discover Scuba with the same shop using 63s in the pool. I can understand using 63s in pool sessions cause you just don't need that much gas, but not during checkout-dives where the extra stress of a new environment, wetsuits and possibly a bit of "test" nerves will have the students going through air more quickly.
Maybe I was lucky, but for my class, we had 4 students with an instructor and a DM (he may have also been an instructor, dunno) and i think 18 with 2 instructors and a DM for open water (i would have prefered fewer people for that though)
yea that is how we kill the dive industry
I will not take more than 4 students in the pool at a time by myself. I don't have an assistant so that is all the time. In OW my usual process is to take buddy teams on the first two dives and if they have no issues I will take all 4 on dives 3 and 4 if conditions permit. If I cannot see all 4 students due to vis - proximity is not an issue since if they cannot stay together as buddies and as a team they don't even get to open water until they do- then it is buddy teams only. What I may do is have the teams switch up so that they get to dive with each other. If I take all 4 in then I will have them switch buddies during the dive for experience with other divers and to instill the idea that they need to stay close to the team. In my classes buddy separation is not an acceptable occurrence or even option.
OP
RedCash02
Contributor
What? Not sure why you highlighted hobby because in my opinion that's what scuba is for most people.
No offense, but I can't make any sense out of your post. I don't even know where to begin.
I never claimed I was some kind of know-it-all. I'm offering my observations and trying to provide some constructive criticism on the current state of the industry. And in doing so, I hope in some small part it may change the shape of the future instruction.
Not sure who you're even addressing with this. I agree that education is more important that top-end gear. For the average consumer they probably have 1 or 2 scuba shops to chose from for BOW. They probably don't know anything about scuba, so how would they know what they need to be taught and if the course should be structured differently? The course content is largely defined by agencies like PADI, NAUI, etc.
I don't see anything demeaning in all of the posts here. I realize I was once that freshly certified BOW diver. I'll be the first to admit I wasn't quite ready to dive on my own. I was lucky that I had a more experienced family member to help me with my first dives.
If this topic makes a new diver question their abilities, then good. Hubris is a particularly deadly sin when it comes to diving. I question my abilities before every dive; if it's beyond my comfort level then I don't get in the water. You can be a perfectly safe diver with just BOW training if you dive within your limits.
This whole thread was about shaping the future. I don't know what to tell you.
OP
RedCash02
Contributor
Blackwood answered this for you, but here's a guide on rock bottom:
Rock Bottom and Gas Management for Recreational Divers | Spherical Chicken
or you can just search SB.
I figured it was something like that, I just wasn't sure if there was some new rock bottom calculation out there that was a lot more conservative.
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