Not everyone thinks cave diving is the pinnacle of SCUBA!

[MXGratefulDiver]

Well except for the few hundreds times I was inside a wreck, yeah. The point is if a diver is comfortable with zero vis, that is one less factor working against that diver in a bad situation. I've seen more than one diver in OW get turned around in zero vis and start to panic. I've been diving limited vis all my life it's just another happy day to me.

Different environments have to be taken into account.

Kinda like the time I went to Hawaii. As we're circling for a landing on Maui I look down and notice a brown ring encircling the island. Later in the day I stopped in a dive shop to rent a tank, thinking to go do a dive at Makena. The guy wouldn't rent me one ... he said vis was below 10 feet. I told him that I dive less vis than that at home all the time. He told me at home we don't have tiger sharks, and in poor vis they might mistake me for something they normally eat.

Always gotta consider the environment. There's a reason why experienced cavers will exit the cave ... or choose not to dive at all ... if the vis is blown out.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Akroedge540]

Different environments have to be taken into account.

Kinda like the time I went to Hawaii. As we're circling for a landing on Maui I look down and notice a brown ring encircling the island. Later in the day I stopped in a dive shop to rent a tank, thinking to go do a dive at Makena. The guy wouldn't rent me one ... he said vis was below 10 feet. I told him that I dive less vis than that at home all the time. He told me at home we don't have tiger sharks, and in poor vis they might mistake me for something they normally eat.

Always gotta consider the environment. There's a reason why experienced cavers will exit the cave ... or choose not to dive at all ... if the vis is blown out.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

+10000

It's my belief that cave training is as much about the skills as it is the attitude and mental awareness. It's crucial to know when to turn and get out before it gets bad.

 

[TONY CHANEY]

Wow, not too sure where to begain but; 1) sorry to hear of the death of the lady on the dive boat and thanks for the "rest of the story." 2) You did the right thing in stopping your dive and and missing some good pictures and watching over the "bottom walker" diver? 3) I have had a 2 light failures in Peanut and buddy in front did not notice right away. I never lost my mind and simply resorted to my training, deployed the 3rd light and let my buddy know we are leaving. Simply...you can get enough training and should always be willing to learn. 4) I once pushed a fellow Marine as a jet engine was falling due to a hoist failing (he thanked me), grabbed my sister-in-law from the river bank where a rather large water moccasin was right at her feet (she thanked me), grabbed my daughter's hands as she started to touch the outdoor fire place (she did not thank me but will do better in life without burns to her hands.) Should I have done these actions, there have been more, or simply watch the accident? I do feel that we are our brother's keeper and human instinct does come into play. Now in the caves we are talking about a different situation. By not being trained you are now placing my life or others in danger. So if we were on the rifle or pistol range and you were trying to clear a jammed round, do you not think that it is right of me to grab the barrel and point it in a sake direction because you were too focused on the rifle and not noticing that you were pointing it a JamesK? (Sorry James) I feel that we are responsile for watching out for accidents and yes some of you are an accident waiting to happen. It's no different than you getting ready to step out into the street and not seeing the car heading for and I grab you to prevent you from being hit. Trust me, you would thank me for that. 5) Trust me on this one...if you are in a silited out small cave, low on air and lost, the last think you are going to think about is deploying your pigsticker. Chances are you will be kissing my backside for saving your's. I feel that some of you support my belief that you shouls have more dives than postings.

 

[JamesK]

. So if we were on the rifle or pistol range and you were trying to clear a jammed round, do you not think that it is right of me to grab the barrel and point it in a sake direction because you were too focused on the rifle and not noticing that you were pointing it a JamesK? (Sorry James).

No worries! I have lots of weapons pointed at me with my job. It usually ends with someone at parade rest or face down in the sand getting an ass chewing that would make R. Lee Ermey proud. lol

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I feel that some of you support my belief that you shouls have more dives than postings.

... so how many dives have you done since joining ScubaBoard in August 2010?

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[kotik]

I feel that some of you support my belief that you shouls have more dives than postings.

Amen.

Edit--
Maybe I ought to face my own bias here... some people should dive more than they post.

Some people, on the other hand, say things I agree with.

 

[SWAMPY459]

edit: sorry that should have been the quote you quoted by tony... ". So if we were on the rifle or pistol range and you were trying to clear a jammed round, do you not think that it is right of me to grab the barrel and point it in a sake direction because you were too focused on the rifle and not noticing that you were pointing it a JamesK? (Sorry James).
"



Do you walk down the street and snatch cigarettes out of peoples mouths because they are unhealthy?

Do you see base jumpers and run cut their cords before they jump because their chutes might not open?

Do you jump into race cars and plant your own foot on the brake because they are driving fast and might crash?

Do you push fat people out of line at the grocery store because you think they are eating unhealthy?

Do you break into houses and steal guns because people might shoot themselves?

Just how far are you willing to go to push YOUR morals on someone else.

If I want to go into a cave and swim until my little tanks empty there's NO LAW to stop me. The police cannot even stop me because there is NO LAW against it. and you.. YOU sir, have NO right, not an obligation, not a right, no reason at all, to do so.

and at the same time, I have no right to stop YOU from cave diving.

THAT IS THE BEAUTY OF A FREE COUNTRY.

 

[JamesK]

Do you walk down the street and snatch cigarettes out of peoples mouths because they are unhealthy?

Do you see base jumpers and run cut their cords before they jump because their chutes might not open?

Do you jump into race cars and plant your own foot on the brake because they are driving fast and might crash?

Do you push fat people out of line at the grocery store because you think they are eating unhealthy?

Do you break into houses and steal guns because people might shoot themselves?

Just how far are you willing to go to push YOUR morals on someone else.

If I want to go into a cave and swim until my little tanks empty there's NO LAW to stop me. The police cannot even stop me because there is NO LAW against it. and you.. YOU sir, have NO right, not an obligation, not a right, no reason at all, to do so.

and at the same time, I have no right to stop YOU from cave diving.

THAT IS THE BEAUTY OF A FREE COUNTRY.

How in the hell do you go from my post that you quoted, to your rant above, which is totally off base for one. Because for one, you have no right to cave access. None of us do. We have the privilege of land owners allowing us to dive their caves.

On a side note, I might go push a far person at Publix today. I am sure I could get millions of hits on YouTube. You sir are hired if you would like to work on the RADAR project. We could use a mind as twisted as yours.

 

[Akroedge540]

Do you walk down the street and snatch cigarettes out of peoples mouths because they are unhealthy?

Do you see base jumpers and run cut their cords before they jump because their chutes might not open?

Do you jump into race cars and plant your own foot on the brake because they are driving fast and might crash?

Do you push fat people out of line at the grocery store because you think they are eating unhealthy?

Do you break into houses and steal guns because people might shoot themselves?

Just how far are you willing to go to push YOUR morals on someone else.

If I want to go into a cave and swim until my little tanks empty there's NO LAW to stop me. The police cannot even stop me because there is NO LAW against it. and you.. YOU sir, have NO right, not an obligation, not a right, no reason at all, to do so.

and at the same time, I have no right to stop YOU from cave diving.

THAT IS THE BEAUTY OF A FREE COUNTRY.

.

You're exactly right!!! There is no LAW, and you cannot be stopped. Congratulations, you proved a point. You win! There's no Cave Police. It IS a free country. Do what you want!

However, no one is pushing ANY moral agenda. What we are pushing are a set of guidelines generated from the deaths of people just like you.

On page 43 of basic cave diving "a blueprint for survival" there's 10 recommendations. Number 10 is "never permit overconfidence to allow you to rationalize violating recommended safety procedures"

I guess you already knew that being self trained and all.

 

[TONY CHANEY]

Amen.

Edit--
Maybe I ought to face my own bias here... some people should dive more than they post.
Some people, on the other hand, say things I agree with.

OK I like that better than my view. But to answer NWGRATEFULDIVER: Actually I was on here I think around 1999-2000 you know back when UnclePug (I can still see his avatar) was on here alot, I hope that he is OK. So I have now 349 post and over 600 dives.