Take good care of your back.
And enjoy your adventure on what ever you decided.
All the best.
Next step / possible training to pursue
- Thread starter Cdncoldwater
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And enjoy your adventure on what ever you decided.
All the best.
Marie,
I also have a back injury—so much so—the VA decided to give me a rating for it after serving in two wars. I think the thing here is; it's not about traveling a few miles north (I'm in the Midwest). It's about providing the right tool for the job. IMHO, if you want to go the route of tech/cave, you should be willing to have an open mind and take the most demanding course out there. It does not matter if you pass or not—it's about the challenge and willingness to learn new things and join a great community. GUE is not some monster lurking in the depths—it's a fantastic training organization that seeks to help one achieve their goals safely and in a team environment. I'm genuinely sorry you have had someone somewhere give you a wrong impression about GUE, and I'd be happy to dive with you and hopefully you will notice we are not like the internet trolls say we are.
Nevertheless, if OP would like to go a different route, that's cool with me.
Cheers and happy diving .
@Hartattack
What I take issue with is the knee jerk blanket response of “take Fundies” for everyone. Are you going to tell someone with a shoulder injury who is unable to do valve drills on doubles to take Fundies? GUE is not into “adaptive” diving, as far as I can tell.
I dive SM myself due to knee/sciatica issues that left me in a great deal of pain after just walking my small HP80 doubles around the quarry. As a result, you will not see me in doubles again. I roll my tanks down to the water whenever possible. Just because YOU with a back injury are still able to dive doubles, doesn’t mean everyone - like the OP - with a back injury will be able to.
My tech/cave instructor, who is not “hack instructor” (per @rjack321), is all for diving in ways that work for the individual. She’s the one who got me back into SM. GUE’s way of diving doesn’t work for me.
I don’t give a flying fig if Fundies is the bee’s knees. I’m not going to risk my knees and be in massive pain just to dive the way someone who doesn’t know me thinks is better. I highly doubt it would be appreciated if someone showed up for Fundies with a SM rig.
What I take issue with is the knee jerk blanket response of “take Fundies” for everyone. Are you going to tell someone with a shoulder injury who is unable to do valve drills on doubles to take Fundies? GUE is not into “adaptive” diving, as far as I can tell.
I dive SM myself due to knee/sciatica issues that left me in a great deal of pain after just walking my small HP80 doubles around the quarry. As a result, you will not see me in doubles again. I roll my tanks down to the water whenever possible. Just because YOU with a back injury are still able to dive doubles, doesn’t mean everyone - like the OP - with a back injury will be able to.
My tech/cave instructor, who is not “hack instructor” (per @rjack321), is all for diving in ways that work for the individual. She’s the one who got me back into SM. GUE’s way of diving doesn’t work for me.
I don’t give a flying fig if Fundies is the bee’s knees. I’m not going to risk my knees and be in massive pain just to dive the way someone who doesn’t know me thinks is better. I highly doubt it would be appreciated if someone showed up for Fundies with a SM rig.
Marie,
This conversation is not a slugfest here; yes, I would recommend fundies to that person as long as they talk to their instructor first. It is not all about valve drills—it's about diving as a team and diving safely. Many students come to GUE with aliments, etc.; however, a rec or tech pass is not the goal. While those certifications can be earned—the goal is learning how to dive as a good teammate and gaining new knowledge and tips and tricks that might make diving easier for the person taking the course. Like I said before, we are not some monsters turning folks away because they have a physical issue. I and many others recommend Fundamentals and GUE courses because we understand the value of the course the student will get. When it comes to GUE, one does not have to look up the instructor—you know that it will be up to the highest standard of instruction. This is why it can take up to three years as an intern to become an instructor for the agency. Once again, I'm sorry you received the wrong impression about us from the internet and I hope to get the chance to dive with you soon.
Cheers.
@Hartattack
What I take issue with is the knee jerk blanket response of “take Fundies” for everyone. Are you going to tell someone with a shoulder injury who is unable to do valve drills on doubles to take Fundies? GUE is not into “adaptive” diving, as far as I can tell.
I dive SM myself due to knee/sciatica issues that left me in a great deal of pain after just walking my small HP80 doubles around the quarry. As a result, you will not see me in doubles again. I roll my tanks down to the water whenever possible. Just because YOU with a back injury are still able to dive doubles, doesn’t mean everyone - like the OP - with a back injury will be able to.
My tech/cave instructor, who is not “hack instructor” (per @rjack321), is all for diving in ways that work for the individual. She’s the one who got me back into SM. GUE’s way of diving doesn’t work for me.
I don’t give a flying fig if Fundies is the bee’s knees. I’m not going to risk my knees and be in massive pain just to dive the way someone who doesn’t know me thinks is better. I highly doubt it would be appreciated if someone showed up for Fundies with a SM rig.
my counterpoint to this is that you have no direct experience with fundies, and are making assumptions. While gue is strict on their requirements of dive configuration and things that must be done to pass, a gue instructor does have the ability to make suggestions that could help adapt their requirements and your requirements to meet in the middle. I have heard 50 people say they can’t do valve drills due to bad injuries or mobility issues. Many of them I went back years later and talked about it with were eventually taught a way to reach their valves or went through training/pt that allowed it. Not all, but the majority. I’m not saying that to discount your injury since I don’t know you. I’m just making the counterpoint. People think gue is this rigid system that isn’t looking to work with people’s issues. That’s just not accurate. They just don’t adapt their requirements for passing the class. But any good gue instructor who’s taught a lot of fundies has tricks up their sleeves that can help most people with issues that stem from injuries, bad habits, or bad mobility. Going into my fundies we were sent multiple articles specifically on how to prepare our shoulders and make them more mobile for valve drills. That’s not saying it fixes all issues, but it shows that gue instructors know about and consider these things. I have seen them put people in tiny light tanks because that persona had trouble walking “normal” doubles.
My most important point though, is your thought process is that you could never pass fundies based on your personal injuries/disabilities is the wrong way to think of it. I went into fundies not caring if I passed or failed. The reason being, is because I’ve been familiar with the gue system for so long, I knew even if I failed because I couldn’t reach my valves or etc I would still learn a great deal from the class. I’n not trying to argue or talk you into fundies. I don’t really care if anyone else takes it or not. I’m only making the counterpoint that you’re arguing points that actually may be nonissues based on your belief that every aspect of gue in unbending. Gue has been working hard to break those stereotypes that were created by people like GI3. While they may not pass a person who can’t do valve drills, that doesn’t mean a good gue instructor won’t work their ass off to find a way to make it work for that person. And in the end they may not be able to. But I guarantee you’ll learn just as much from a failed fundies course as you would passing.
It’s a moot point. I dive SM. No doubles, no single tank. No Fundies. I’ve done plenty of stuff just for knowledge. Will I do Fundies? No. And no means no.
It appears that he has by stating he is not interested in back mount due to a back injury. Your continued insistence that fundies is the only way to go is tending to perpetuate some of the stereotypes associated with GUE rather than dispelling them .
MichaelMc
Working toward Cenotes
OP dives "primarily sidemount". You can do GUE Fundies in single tank, though that seems not convenient for the OP.
But GUE is not the only group that teaches "a fundamentals class".
IANTD has an essentials class in sidemount at the rec., tech-lite and tech levels.
Rec Essentials:
"designed to enhance the student’s personal and team underwater skills. Development of buoyancy, trim, balance and propulsion. Refine and expand fundamental diving skills. Equipment Streamlining and configuration. Diving safety, situational awareness and accident prevention. Enhanced Dive planning and gas management. Decompression overview and minimum decompression procedures."
But GUE is not the only group that teaches "a fundamentals class".
IANTD has an essentials class in sidemount at the rec., tech-lite and tech levels.
Rec Essentials:
"designed to enhance the student’s personal and team underwater skills. Development of buoyancy, trim, balance and propulsion. Refine and expand fundamental diving skills. Equipment Streamlining and configuration. Diving safety, situational awareness and accident prevention. Enhanced Dive planning and gas management. Decompression overview and minimum decompression procedures."
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