Troll or joke?
newly certified
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Troll or joke?
landlocked
Contributor
Do you still route the primary under your right arm with a 40 inch hose? Why a 40 inch instead of 60 inches? When using a 60 inch hose to you wrap it around the neck? Finally, how do you decide between a 22 and and 24 inch hose for the backup?
Ziggys_Friend
Guest
"newly certified"
Any opinions on going with a pony bottle rather then an octopus?
I was certified last September with my girlfriend and am slowly accumulating equipment over the winter. Can't wait to get in the water. The NorthEast is cold here as you all know. Back to my question octo,air2, or pony bottle?"
Getting back to the question...
As a fellow newbie I started with the traditional Reg/Octo set-up and am quickly moving to a 7' primary with a 24" backup. However, while going with an H valve is in my near future, this configuration works quite well without the 2nd 1st stage and is a great improvement without adding significant cost or complexity.
The pony bottle is really a separate issue - tech divers will rightly tell you/us that they are not needed and should be avoided at all costs. However, they do tend to be diving with doubles or with an H valve giving them a lot more redundancy than you have with a single 1st stage. As a new diver without doubled 1st stages and a single AL80 tank, I think a strong case can still be made for a pony. However, I admit a stronger case can be made for moving to an H valve and 2nd 1st stage at which point IMHO the pendulum clearly swings toward not adding another piece of equipment. (Remember, a pony bottle means you've now got THREE 2nd stages as you would never want to not have a real backup/Octo and three is clearly asking for trouble).
From what I've seen and hear, the only "legitimate" use of a pony is on vacation in a recreational diving situation when you don't really know the gear, can't bring your own doubles and/or H valve setup etc. Though again, the ideal would be to have your own gear.
Finally a word to the wise regarding attaching a pony bottle to your setup should you go that route. There are lots of fancy items out there such as the "Pony Tamer" etc. They look great but in real life they take forever to switch from tank to tank so unless you're diving with a single tank and having it refilled each time (such as on a lot of boat dives) you'd be much better off with a system that is fast and easy to put on/take off and allows switching out tanks.
Anyway that's the thinking/learning curve I've gone through.
Paul
Any opinions on going with a pony bottle rather then an octopus?
I was certified last September with my girlfriend and am slowly accumulating equipment over the winter. Can't wait to get in the water. The NorthEast is cold here as you all know. Back to my question octo,air2, or pony bottle?"
Getting back to the question...
As a fellow newbie I started with the traditional Reg/Octo set-up and am quickly moving to a 7' primary with a 24" backup. However, while going with an H valve is in my near future, this configuration works quite well without the 2nd 1st stage and is a great improvement without adding significant cost or complexity.
The pony bottle is really a separate issue - tech divers will rightly tell you/us that they are not needed and should be avoided at all costs. However, they do tend to be diving with doubles or with an H valve giving them a lot more redundancy than you have with a single 1st stage. As a new diver without doubled 1st stages and a single AL80 tank, I think a strong case can still be made for a pony. However, I admit a stronger case can be made for moving to an H valve and 2nd 1st stage at which point IMHO the pendulum clearly swings toward not adding another piece of equipment. (Remember, a pony bottle means you've now got THREE 2nd stages as you would never want to not have a real backup/Octo and three is clearly asking for trouble).
From what I've seen and hear, the only "legitimate" use of a pony is on vacation in a recreational diving situation when you don't really know the gear, can't bring your own doubles and/or H valve setup etc. Though again, the ideal would be to have your own gear.
Finally a word to the wise regarding attaching a pony bottle to your setup should you go that route. There are lots of fancy items out there such as the "Pony Tamer" etc. They look great but in real life they take forever to switch from tank to tank so unless you're diving with a single tank and having it refilled each time (such as on a lot of boat dives) you'd be much better off with a system that is fast and easy to put on/take off and allows switching out tanks.
Anyway that's the thinking/learning curve I've gone through.
Paul
Ziggys_Friend
Guest
Missed one ...
Re: Air2 - I've gone that route and would definitely stay away from it. If you read any number of threads here on backup regs you'll read again and again the point that if you have to hand off your primary to another diver in an emergency, you don't want to be left using an inferior one - and that's exactly what an air2 is IMHO.
Also, should you decide not to go with a long primary and short backup configuration as most of us have been suggesting, it's still way better to have a regular Octo setup than depend upon a Pony ... not nearly as good as the alternate set-up, but sure better than the pony.
In my case, I was talked into buying a pony and reg which now just sit. I wasted more money on it than I would have spent to set my gear up right with an H valve the first time.
~P
Re: Air2 - I've gone that route and would definitely stay away from it. If you read any number of threads here on backup regs you'll read again and again the point that if you have to hand off your primary to another diver in an emergency, you don't want to be left using an inferior one - and that's exactly what an air2 is IMHO.
Also, should you decide not to go with a long primary and short backup configuration as most of us have been suggesting, it's still way better to have a regular Octo setup than depend upon a Pony ... not nearly as good as the alternate set-up, but sure better than the pony.
In my case, I was talked into buying a pony and reg which now just sit. I wasted more money on it than I would have spent to set my gear up right with an H valve the first time.
~P
King Kong Matt
Contributor
I guess I don't understand this statement. Can you please explain?
Thanks,
KKM
Ziggys_Friend
Guest
King Kong Matt ...
From my (albiet limited) experience - the one time I know a lot of divers bring pony bottles is when they are traveling and can't (for whatever reason) dive with a rig they know well and that has doubled 1st stages etc. (Doubles or H valve). That seems to be a situation where they decide the added compexity of a pony is off set by the added safety.
I'm not saying that's the best way to go, only that that seems to be one situation where many of my very experience dive friends agree they want a pony bottle as well as primary and backup/octo.
Is the water getting any clearer?
From my (albiet limited) experience - the one time I know a lot of divers bring pony bottles is when they are traveling and can't (for whatever reason) dive with a rig they know well and that has doubled 1st stages etc. (Doubles or H valve). That seems to be a situation where they decide the added compexity of a pony is off set by the added safety.
I'm not saying that's the best way to go, only that that seems to be one situation where many of my very experience dive friends agree they want a pony bottle as well as primary and backup/octo.
Is the water getting any clearer?
Route it under your right arm and straight up to your mouth... not around the back of the neck... you couldn't anyway... unless you are mini-me.
5' hose is fine for those without a canister or knife or ACB to loop the 7' hose under before bringing it up across the chest to the left and then around the back of the neck.
Backup reg hose length.... both Shane and I use 28" on our doubles rig. I use a 23" on my singles rig. Shane uses a 28" on his... but it is too long.
landlocked
Contributor
Thanks pug. I'm thinking 40 and 23 (strictly single at this point. It may happen this summer. 
Now back to the regularly scheduled program.....
Fairly new diver. Hmm... At this point, it would seem to me, that you might want to be focusing on learning buddy skills (your buddy being a great redundant air supply) and that you may be better served by leaving pony bottles, doubles, etc. for later. I would suggest that you go with a octo in any of the afore mentioned configurations as long as it doesn't drag in the sand and you can sweep for a lost primary without pulling the octo lose! Learn to focus on what is going on around you and practice using the octo with your buddy. Is your girlfriend still diving with you? I find great satisfaction in diving with mine.
Now back to the regularly scheduled program.....
Fairly new diver. Hmm... At this point, it would seem to me, that you might want to be focusing on learning buddy skills (your buddy being a great redundant air supply) and that you may be better served by leaving pony bottles, doubles, etc. for later. I would suggest that you go with a octo in any of the afore mentioned configurations as long as it doesn't drag in the sand and you can sweep for a lost primary without pulling the octo lose! Learn to focus on what is going on around you and practice using the octo with your buddy. Is your girlfriend still diving with you? I find great satisfaction in diving with mine.
Don't fixate on 23"... that is just what I measured mine as... and I was using my wifes cloth sewing tape measure... it could be anywhere from 22~24
Don't go buying a custom made hose... just get a 24" one.
usil
Guest
yes I beleive in one reg and a good buddy
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