New Wreck In Picton!!!

[PatH]

i was just wondering cuz i didn`t think tdi deco is a helium course.

Their first deco course is not a trimix course. That is a separate qualification with TDI.

 

[StatusMaker]

And it was an NAUI OW 1 student that removed the lines from the wreck (well I was at one time right!) :1poke:


Darryl Koster

 

[Dan MacKay]

So tell me.....how does one remove grappling hooks, cave line, ploy line etc. without touching or disturbing the wreck? I guess this person/s would have special permission from the government to break some of the laws that they support sooo much !
Even those that rant about other people breaking the law decide for themselves what laws are ok for themselves to break!
Is a law a law or not? If someone decides to break a law (for whatever reason) then he has no right to tell another to abide by the same law! Is it "splitting hairs"? Sure it is. But the point is that even those who say dont touch anything on the wreck (because its illegal you know) and then remove something (for whatever reason) are simply taking their own ideals and use them to justify their actions. Someone who takes a glass jar off a wreck and someone who takes a grappling hook off a wreck are breaking the same law. They simply justify it in their own way.
What were you saying about human psychology Steve???!!!

Well...............?

No justification necessary. Crowbars and air chisels work quite nicely to clean up a wreck although I find the use of chainsaws particularly useful myself.

Dan

 

[StatusMaker]

Actually Dan on this type of wreck and the length of time its been down there a chainsaw would probably work really well. Cut through those masts in a matter of seconds. There are two, wanna share. I need a new flagpole in my front yard anyways!


Darryl Koster

PS. before anyone gets their panties tied up any tighter in a knot you have to understand that I dont have enough room in my front yard for a flag pole....so I would have to chop a hole in my living room floor and top floor then my roof, then I could have this great flagpole coming out of my house...it would even have a crows nest on it....oh..hold on...apparently Beth would not like that.

 

[Dan MacKay]

It was a "TDI Deco diver" that removed the grapnel from the wreck! The same "TDI Deco diver" recognized the potential for damage to the wreck and cut the line running between the masts.

You do us all a disservice when you paint everyone with the same brush. It would almost be like me saying... Oh! Another evangelical GUE holier-than-thou post. "What a surprise."

There have been a small fraction of us instructing within each and every agency that have held the highest standards since long before GUE came about. Is it your intention to make diving in general better? Or, just forward the aims of your GUE friends?

BTW other than the political BS, I agree with your post.
The mechanical advantage of a line strung between two points and then deflected in the middle is phenomenal. This careless, misguided act could have easily destroyed the unique beauty of this wreck in an instant.
Anyone who would drag an anchor or a grapnel into a wreck, or any part of it, for any reason, in this day and age... can only be described as greedy and selfish... and should be shot! I plan to have the item in the picture mounted as a monument to stupidity.

Dear Neutral Buoyancy,

Although James tends to be a little exhuberant in expressing his opinions and his generalizations may be somewhat improper the point he made is a valid one. The point being that some divers that were certified by other organizations did indeed do the dastardly deed of tying the wreck to the bottom so it wouldn't get away. It was also very nice of them to clean the wreck up so nicely of all the artifacts that were cluttering up the area making it look like an eyesore. Others, such as yourself untied it and set it free again and for that I applaud you.

If however it had been under the stewardship of any GUE divers I think that it would been very unlikely that they would have found it necessary to restrain the wreck in any way as their skills are sufficient to use a shot line as an visual guide for an ascent or barring that doing a free ascent (hence no need to hook the wreck). As well part of our core training is aimed at enviromental awareness and presevation unlike other organizations. It is one thing to talk about the importance of not touching a wreck and it is something else entirely to have the skill to be able to not touch a wreck.

My opinion has always been that wreck preservation and enviomental awareness begins not when the diver begins to dive more agressively but when they start their openwater and onwards through their careers. If they do not have the correct skills they cannot stay off the wrecks or ascend without aids. If they do not have the correct attitudes then they do not see anything wrong with it. They are so unaware that they just do not know what they do not know. How we go about correcting this is another matter entirely.

Safe dives,

Dan

 

[StatusMaker]

Rope, rope and more rope. Keep in mind that is a business card beside the rope and its actually about 8 inches off the ground and the centre is wound pretty tight (wanted to make sure that at 160' I didnt become a part of the ship.).

Darryl Koster

 

[Dive Source]

If however it had been under the stewardship of any GUE divers I think that it would been very unlikely that they would have found it necessary to restrain the wreck in any way as their skills are sufficient to use a shot line as an visual guide for an ascent or barring that doing a free ascent (hence no need to hook the wreck). As well part of our core training is aimed at enviromental awareness and presevation unlike other organizations. It is one thing to talk about the importance of not touching a wreck and it is something else entirely to have the skill to be able to not touch a wreck.

These are certainly skills valued in any diver and it is great to see that GUE makes this type of attitude part of it's program (officially or unofficially).

One advantage I believe that GUE had in developing it's "image" is the ability to learn from the past from both the diving and Public Relations mistakes of others. I applaud you Dan for not painting everyone with the same brush based on the mistakes of few and your attitude not to judge people (a sometimes rare trait here at scubaboard which is often full of visceral responses and judgements).

There are many good divers from lots of agencies out there and to blacklist them all because of the actions of a few is a dangerous thing especially when history and statistics shows us that eventually every group or organization will have those who break the rules and tarnish the reputation of others around them.

It's an old adage but still very true today - "He That Is Without Sin Among You, Let Him First Cast a Stone"

Perhaps in the end this discussion will help educate anyone who goes diving to be more aware of how they are impacting historical treasures such as these.

 

[Dan MacKay]

These are certainly skills valued in any diver and it is great to see that GUE makes this type of attitude part of it's program (officially or unofficially).

One advantage I believe that GUE had in developing it's "image" is the ability to learn from the past from both the diving and Public Relations mistakes of others. I applaud you Dan for not painting everyone with the same brush based on the mistakes of few and your attitude not to judge people (a sometimes rare trait here at scubaboard which is often full of visceral responses and judgements).

There are many good divers from lots of agencies out there and to blacklist them all because of the actions of a few is a dangerous thing especially when history and statistics shows us that eventually every group or organization will have those who break the rules and tarnish the reputation of others around them.

It's an old adage but still very true today - "He That Is Without Sin Among You, Let Him First Cast a Stone"

Perhaps in the end this discussion will help educate anyone who goes diving to be more aware of how they are impacting historical treasures such as these.

Hi Brian,

Thank you for your insight and perhaps sending us down the right road here. Your thoughts on this will hopefully keep this thread from backsliding into an interagency slugfest and place the focus where it belongs - an effort to protect and preserve these wrecks.

 

[divedude]

I, for one applaud the efforts of NeutralBuoyancy and or others for removing the line and hook.............. Well Done!

I believe it was his first dive, maybe second on this wreck....
and he took the time out of his dive to do it.

So what I am wondering is why the other "concerned" divers that have been on the wreck before didn't do it before???

BTW....... A certifying agency does not make a "Good Diver" the diver that has commitment and dedication to the sport and to the betterment of the sport, make a "Great Diver"

Big Jim..... King of all stroke divers.......And proud of it!

 

[StatusMaker]

Time to let this post go, people are not reading everything anymore nor are they seemingly understanding (or interested in finding out) what has been written or has in reality happened.

See ya somewhere on the water!


Darryl Koster