Need help in selecting Dig SLR

[mjh]

This is a hobby, like many, there is always something bigger and better coming out. With the exception of lenses I have bought all my equipment used and saved a ton of money. Example just bought an S&S 350 Pro for US$600 vs. $1200; clean, and works great. For an amateur like me, just making slide shows, mounting on the wall and posting at sites like this, my D100 works great. If I had the skills to shoot the pictures the gear is capable of I could publish a book. Inevitably a little "gear envy" sets in but when I do upgrade in a couple of years I can rationalize it by the money I saved buying used.

 

[regtech17]

Hello, my name is Steve and i currently use a Nikon D100 in an Aquatica housing. I am lookking to sell the set up if you are interested. I have the following D100, 12-24 and 60mm lenses, wide angle port and macro ports with the necessary focus gears and auto manual selector, 512 and 1gb extreme cards, aquatica housing with dual strobe connectors, two sea and sea ys350 pro strobes, light and motion 20 watt focus light, moisture alarm, two o ring rebuild kits. The set up is two years old except for the strobes and focus light they are new.


Steve

 

[dbh]

" You cannot shoot what you cannot see"

The fundamentel problem most beginners overlook with an UW DSLR or SLR is that there is a MIRROR blocking the view of the CCD sensor or film (SLR). So the LCD display is totally useless before one snaps the picture! In any SLR or DSLRs you are totally relying on the VIEWFINDER to see the image before taking the shot. The LCD display can be used to review the picture but by the time you are ready to make the correction, that fish is long gone.

Next time you go out to kick some tires for an UW use DSLR, try this simple test, hold the viewfinder about 4 inches from your eye. Now which of the cameras below could you see the greatest amout of image area from 4 inches away? You guess it, the Nikon D2H/D2X has the largest DSLR viewfinder to date and an added bonus, the UW housing, 2X viewfinder magnifier bolts on directly to the ROUND D2 eyepiece making the image even larger! The LCD display is also a large 2.5 inches!

The Evolt has the smallest view finder of the four, also one of the largest Gimmick I have seen in a while. If there was an advantage in placing the mirror sideways they would have done so a long time ago.

Could this be why I see a much better composed UW pictures from a point and shoot 5050/5060 (LCD viewfinder) than a low end DSLR?

Actually I have used both underwater and I find composing / shooting thru a viewfinder easier than a LCD. It is also much easier (IMHO) to see if your intended subject is in focus. Why would you hold a DSLR 4" away ??? I have mine against my mask (or close to it). With a DSLR you will get less OOF pics and ALOT less "Butt Shots"

Dave

 

[ssra30]

Could this be why I see a much better composed UW pictures from a point and shoot 5050/5060 (LCD viewfinder) than a low end DSLR?

I think it depends on the situation. The smallish viewfinder on the D70 gave me problem sometimes when I try to position myself with the camera in a tight spot.
But I have to say that when I switched from C5050 to D70, I did not really miss not being able to use LCD monitor to compose.
However using D70 with 70-180mm lens (which is my favourite setup for macro shots), it is certainly not as easy to maneuver the D70 around in Sea and Sea housing as C5050 in Ikelite housing. The longer lens lenght certainly make fine adjustment of the camera position a bit more difficult and with the face pretty much glue to the viewfinder rather than holding the camera a foot away from the mask certainly did not help.
I am looking at D2X with Subal housing/GS view finder which I think will help solve some of these problems.

 

[f3nikon]

Actually I have used both underwater and I find composing / shooting thru a viewfinder easier than a LCD. It is also much easier (IMHO) to see if your intended subject is in focus. Why would you hold a DSLR 4" away ??? I have mine against my mask (or close to it). With a DSLR you will get less OOF pics and ALOT less "Butt Shots"

Dave

Fair enough, maybe like 3 or 2 inches from the front surface of your eyeball to the glass surface of the D70 eyepiece. Please take into account the distance between your eye and the lens on the low volume dive mask plus the thickness of the dive mask glass plus the over hang of the dive mask frame. Now even if we have the mask as close to the camera housing as possible we still have a recessed housing viewport with an overhang to prevent the glass to glass contact with the mask lens plus the thickness of the housing viewport then the distance between the housing viewport and the camera eyepiece itself. 2.5 inches at best, I measured it. Try looking at the D70 viewport from 2 inches away, can you see the entire image without shifting your head around or moving the camera? The answer is no, I have a Nikon 8008s High Eyepoint viewfinder which is about the same size as the D2H/X and I have to move my head or camera around to see the entire frame and never at one time. The D70's viewfinder is 1/3 less the size!

D70s require that your eye be less than 1/2 inch from the eyepiece in order to view the entire image at once. This really handicaps you in the composition dept. because in order to place the image where you what it you must move your head or camera to check all four corners for proper placement, either way adds extra thought process to the mix. Then you are not sure if you had shifted the camera around during all this movement, throwing the focus off, so you recheck again.

This is the main reason why we see so many " Bullseye" type of shots, where the subject is dead center of the photograph, we are just happy to get an image that is in focus! Since at any given time we only see less than 50% of the image at best in an UW housing, we pop the shutter the instant the image comes to focus in the middle of the screen. Not thinking about which eye or antenna of the subject should be in sharp focus, be it the lead or rear, depth of field, exposure, background etc.
Composition should be second nature and should go hand in hand with focusing, in an almost single continuous motion.

The "composition" is the part of photography that is YOU. Cameras can be auto focus and auto exposure but I have yet to see a camera that has auto composition!

So much for the Law of 3ths rule.

http://www.homestead.com/fixaphoto/digitalcameratips.html

The point I was making on the last post was if one is starting off in UW photography, start with a point and shoot like a Olympus 5050, 5060, 8080 or the latest Nikon Cool Pix and Canons. If you are really going for the DSLR get one with the largest viewfinder, until then stick with the point and shoot.

PS. Good job on your latest pics from Manado!
Dive Safe

Al

 

[ssra30]

Fair enough, maybe like 3 or 2 inches from the front surface of your eyeball to the glass surface of the D70 eyepiece. Please take into account the distance between your eye and the lens on the low volume dive mask plus the thickness of the dive mask glass plus the over hang of the dive mask frame. Now even if we have the mask as close to the camera housing as possible we still have a recessed housing viewport with an overhang to prevent the glass to glass contact with the mask lens plus the thickness of the housing viewport then the distance between the housing viewport and the camera eyepiece itself. 2.5 inches at best, I measured it. Try looking at the D70 viewport from 2 inches away, can you see the entire image without shifting your head around or moving the camera? The answer is no, I have a Nikon 8008s High Eyepoint viewfinder which is about the same size as the D2H/X and I have to move my head or camera around to see the entire frame and never at one time. The D70's viewfinder is 1/3 less the size!

Al

Actually when I have the housing pressed up against my mask (Mares X-Vision), I can see the entire image on the viewfinder and all the digital readout at the bottom as well. The housing eyepiece does magnify the image a little bit so it is not quite the same as looking through the viewfinder 2 inches away on land.

It is when I can't glue my mask to the housing that it becomes difficult to see the entire viewfinder. I am not sure how this work exactly by one of my divebuddy with the same camera/housing could not see the entire viewfinder either no matter what he does. Heck, on land sometimes I can't see the entire viewfinder when I am wearing my glasses either.

 

[Mike Veitch]

I definitely agree that the viewfinder on the D70 sucks!
I came from the N90 with the external add on eyepiece, loved that. Hate the tiny D70 one. Not even going to mention my Nik V and 15mm eyepiece...

But if you go Subal or Seacam or ? You can get one of those add on viewfinders for another $1500 or so...at that price mine as well buy two or three eh?

Ya right...

Mike

 

[ssra30]

But if you go Subal or Seacam or ? You can get one of those add on viewfinders for another $1500 or so...at that price mine as well buy two or three eh?

Ya right...

Mike

Actually Subal is GS Viewfinder is a bit cheaper than Seacam, coming in at a bargain price of around $US 900 so everyone should definitely get 2 or 3
I did play a bit with D70 Subal housing with GS Viewfinder and it is very nice. Certainly a major improvement for those who can afford one. I certainly would not need to glue my mask to the viewfinder to see everything.

 

[doole]

Nikon WA lenses are better then the current Canon offering.

ymm DEFINITELY v...

There are those who will say that those who use Canon 'L'-series lenses are genetically superior, and have better children, compared to those who don't.

I'm one of those who might even be inclined to agree...

 

[fpoole]

Just an quick footnote on buying camera's I'm hearing rumors that the D100s are going for around $595 or so... I'm guessing due to the new models coming out???
Just wondering if anyone else is seeing that if their shopping for the D100s... what pricings are you finding...
Just wondering..