Near Misses

[RubberDucky]

Bad Air thread on cozumelmycozumel.

 

[DandyDon]

From the tripadvisor thread, this was posted by Debra, the lady who works with the Red Cross in Cozumel and posts here on ScubaBoard (her name there is "ds2"):

As I've met her briefly in person once while on the island, I know she's a real human being, that she works with/for REEF, and having seen plenty of her posts here, I feel I can trust the statement above and not chalk the recent incident as just a rumor.

You can find the TripAdvisor thread here, if you are so inclined.

Edit: I am aware that I quoted something that says CO poisoning was not detected in the afflicted divers. However, I am under no illusion that medical personnel are perfect. One of the chambers I and another family member have been to in Cozumel (the one by the McDonalds, was there only for ear issues) is certainly no exception.

I think Deborah is a fine and honest person, but I got to wonder about her sources and statements there.

Why doesn't the Operator come clean with a statement here, on their web site, anywhere...?!

Be that all as it may, it's still hearsay. IMO, the person with the firsthand info should be the one who makes the Midnight Ride.

OK - but he is not sure if the other guy survived or not...

Map51, Hello I was on the dive with you. I brought my unconscious Uncle up from 90'... are actual ascent time was 42 seconds from 90'.

First my Uncle is back in PA and doing good. After my Uncle came back to life I flew home the next day as planned while he stayed in the hospital to recover.

Also, I would like to know if you know what happened with the first diver that was rescued? I heard while we were at the hospital they couldn't get a heart beat? Do you know if he lived? I know my Uncle and the other diver both lived and should be able to dive again because they had rooms next to each other.

Also, I suspected CO after I got my head around the situation and talked to DAN. Dive Palancar assured me they would test the tanks... however, they have not shared the results. I've asked DAN to try and follow-up.

Below is the recap from my first hand experience:

This message is so I can share with you what happened and hopefully can prevent further dive injuries.

I've done about 500 dives during the last 3 years of which I've done close to 200 in the past 12 months and I have never, ever seen anything like this. My dive buddy (injured diver three in the info below) is a Dive Master since 1975 and dives more than I do.

Location: Cozumel, MX.
Duration: 7-10 days of diving 2 – 3 dives per day
Dive Injury Location: Palancar Reef @ Horse Shoe (between Palancar Caves and Palancar Gardens)
Dive Shop: Dive Palancar, onsite with Alegro Resort and Occidental Grand Hotel
Rescue Dive Shop for Injured diver 1: Dive Palancar, onsite with Alegro Resourts
Rescue Dive Shop for Injured divers 2 and 3: Dressel Divers, onsite with the Iberostar Cozumel Resort.
Dive Gas: All 3 divers were using a standard Air tank.

Incident: 3 of 7 divers injured during descent on a multi-level dive to 90’
Date: Thursday, Feb 11, 2009 about 2:38PM.

Summary of Injury:
Diver 1: Blacked out during descent at about 25 feet, 2 minutes into descent.
Diver 2: Blacked out during continuation of descent to first dive level at about 60 feet, 12 minutes into descent / dive.
Diver 3: Blacked out at first dive level 75 feet 13 minutes into descent / dive.

Condition of Injured divers:
Diver 1: Unknown
Diver 2: Released from Hospital (Friday Feb 12th)
Diver 3: Released from Hospital (Saturday Feb 13th), still suffering minor joint pains

Location of Treatment:
Diver 1: Unknown
Diver 2: Cozumel Internal Clinic, Contact: 987-872-23-87
Diver 3: Initially Treated By Dr. Pascual Piccolo with Meditor:, before stabilizing and being transferred to the Cozumel Internal Clinic.

Details:
First diver blacked out about 2 minutes into the descent, and although I didn't see anything other than him surface and the boat pick him up from about 45' under water (while the descent was paused). I have heard from the dive-talk that he was being treated for a heart attach, and just blacked out during his decent.

Second diver blacked out at about 12 minutes into the dive around 60', I didn't realize what had happened, and frankly I though it was a buoyancy issue because it looked like his wife was trying to pull him down. In talking to him he got light headed, and the last thing he was able to do was inflate his BC.

Third diver blacked out at about 75'. This was my dive buddy and uncle so I witnessed almost the entire event, but it was limited because I was trying to let the dive master know about the second diver and was about 10 seconds away from buddy when he blacked out, and starting taking in water, . By the time I goto my buddy, jammed my octopus into his mouth and got buoyancy under control we were down to 90' before I was able to start the ascent. I noticed he was not breathing and started free flowing his air at which time his eyes blinked for 1 happy second before rolling back and going out. I began an emergency ascent with my buddy in tow from 90' and he started foaming (probable from trapped air in his lungs). Time of ascent was 42 seconds.

Once on the surface the second diver was convulsing, breathing, but non responsive to the situation. Third diver was out, but did have a pulse and seemed to take shallow breath as I used the octopus to force short bursts of air into his lungs every few seconds, until we confirmed he was taking a shallow breath... the best we could do considering we were floating in the ocean.

Next no boat. The boat had taken the first injured diver.

It took at least 10 minutes to secure a rescue boat by using every possible option available (emergency whistles, horns, distressed diver signal, yelling, etc..), during this time the third diver (my buddy) began convulsing but was non responsive to the situation, however I could tell he was now breathing for sure on his own, but it didn't last. And by the time we got him onto the boat I was sure he was dead. However, you don't give up and we began oxygen treatment and within a few minutes he was breathing and convulsing again. At about 20 minutes into the boat ride we ran low on oxygen and additional oxygen was obtained from another dive boat on the water, with the new oxygen we continued full speed ahead to the dock at which time my diver seemed to stabilize and come back to life. Opened his eyes, blinked. I asked him if he knew who I was and he did. I then told him had blacked out at 75' and we had done an emergency ascent and were about 5 minutes from the ambulance.

As we had pulled into dock (in our rescue boat with Dressel Divers at the Iberostar) Dressell had paramedics and a doctor along with two ambulances. During the 30 minute boat ride second diver had stabilized. The 3rd diver (my uncle) was the immediate concern, and was quickly checked out by the doctor who instructed the paramedics to get him into the hospital because his lungs were full of water.

Anyway the story ends well for the 2nd and 3rd diver, who as noted above were both released from hospital. The status of the 1st injured diver is not confirmed.

Misc Notes:
Dive Palancar assured me they were going to test the air in the tanks. When I followed up the next day with the dive shop they avoided the issue. I’ve asked DAN to get this info in the argument of research. I’m sure we had Carbon Monoxide loaded tanks. It is the only way I think you can have bad air and not know it.

I have done some research and I have found only one company that makes a portable CO tester specifically for divers.

Manufacture: Nuvair
Model: Pro CO Analyzer, BC flow adaptor sold separately)
Cost: $400
Website: cant' post the link because of site rules so I'll try to just do this www nuvair com
Carbon Monoxide Analyzer - Pro CO Alarm

We saw 3 other injured divers receive medical treatment during the week with Dive Palancar.

I myself felt fine immediately following the Rapid / Emergency Ascent, and never sought medical treatment in Cozumel, although the Doctor asked me several times how I was doing (somewhat amazed I felt fine).

Since my Uncle had stabilized and was in good care I went ahead and flew home about 20 hours following the rapid ascent. I did start to get DCS symptoms in flight that were very mild (wasn’t a huge concerned because I’ve had some minor DCS symptoms after long periods of diving, that have always gone away in a few days… and was in denial of the mild symptoms until they escalated at day 6 to moderate sharp muscle and joint pain along with the tingles in my arms and legs, and just to make sure I was a mess I got a nice does of vertigo. I was treated quickly by some great doctors in Scottsdale AZ and I’m hopeful I will make a full recovery over the next few weeks. I will post my treatment under another topic since it was delayed DCS treatment it is worth talking about and the way the hyperbaric treatments were administered.

The op is going to test the tanks. Haha

Here is some more "hearsay".........from another ex-pat who has lived on the island for quite sometime......posted today on another forum. Hmmm.

I happened to run into one of the docs that treated some of the affected, so I asked. He did confirm that the cases he treated were in fact CO.

He explained that the problem arose from a truck running near the compressor. He stated that, "the problem has been resolved".

Yeah resolved. Everyone back in the water...!

Any word on how many divers treated and how many dead...?

 

[MikeGT]

I have been with with Dive Palancar for 15 years...NO odor and NO problems (they fill their tanks at the Allegro)!

 

[RubberDucky]

Why doesn't the Operator come clean with a statement here, on their web site, anywhere...?!

The simplest answer is often the correct one, and the simplest thing I can think of is this: because they don't have to.

Or, they may be planning to, but just have not yet done so (hey, I can dream, right?).

I think we'd all love to hear the details of this incident directly from the source, but even then no one is guaranteed to get the complete truth. As most of us are at the mercy of the competence of our dive shops when it comes to getting tanks filled (and humans are not infallible, of course), I think the best course of action is to continue to supplement our current thoughts and posts about this incident with information about CO and CO analyzers. It is my hope to see more threads posted throughout the life of this forum that pertain to this subject. Your post, Don, about your experience in Roatan recently, is a good example of this, in my opinion.

If I go to Cozumel in a few months as planned, I will post a thread about my CO analyzer (when I purchase one) with as much helpful information as possible. Just recently there has been a wealth of helpful information posted about various analyzers. This isn't a topic that should be taboo any longer, tourism be damned.

Stay safe.

 

[tnsean615]

sounds like bad air,that dive should have been called off after the first diver blacked out. that's a real emergency. it was a bad judgement call not to,the other divers problems could have been avoided.

 

[DandyDon]

I have been with with Dive Palancar for 15 years...NO odor and NO problems (they fill their tanks at the Allegro)!

With? You work there? Then give us the details please...?

Or do you mean you dive with them and have been lucky so far...???

 

[Uber]

Why doesn't the Operator come clean with a statement here, on their web site, anywhere...?!

Don't know...I know they are aware of it... I told them personally....as far as I am concerned not responding is akin to a :mooner:.... I am very disappointed...

 

[MMM]

This doesn't sound good. I think DAN needs to get involved in an "in your face" kind of way. That, or disaffiliate itself if there is any risk to divers due to procedures used on site.

 

[DandyDon]

Here is some more "hearsay".........from another ex-pat who has lived on the island for quite sometime......posted today on another forum. Hmmm.

I happened to run into one of the docs that treated some of the affected, so I asked. He did confirm that the cases he treated were in fact CO.

He explained that the problem arose from a truck running near the compressor. He stated that, "the problem has been resolved".

I've thot about this post more today while traveling back from Roatan. The Op I used had air intake pipes 15 feet straight up but seemed to be still intaking some CO, I suppose from the idling boat engines creating a CO plume. My tests were always 5ppm or less so I was fine diving, but I shudder at the large numbers who never test.

But here, at a famous Op on Coz, they seemingly have air intakes that would allow "a truck running near the compressor" to make a difference? Who designed this fill station? Their local tire service? And they resolve the problem by moving the truck I suppose?

Yeah, ask me about diving with that Op...

 

[swamp diver]

Here is some more "hearsay".........from another ex-pat who has lived on the island for quite sometime......posted today on another forum. Hmmm.

I happened to run into one of the docs that treated some of the affected, so I asked. He did confirm that the cases he treated were in fact CO.

He explained that the problem arose from a truck running near the compressor. He stated that, "the problem has been resolved".

Any chance someone could post a photo of the intake relative to its surroundings? One can tell a lot about the fill station from an intake.

In most incidents people assume that it is CO which has been entrained into the intake from an external CO point source as that is all they know, but in reality most CO incidents are likely from a bad compressor install with internal production of CO due to the lubricating oil's combustion (pyrolysis) from overheating. We know that about 3 percent of samples sent into the compressed breathing air laboratories fail on carbon monoxide which would mean a lot of trucks backing up to all these intakes.

In any case aside from physically locating the intake so it is not possible for boat or vehicular exhaust to enter one should always have a sign such as this to prevent such incidents. All fire services in the US and Canada are obligated to have a sign beside the compressor intake. This should be a requirement in the dive industry that DAN could spearhead and support.