Nantucket Lightship

[scubastew]

You'd think diver's are the evil spawn of satan or something.

Most of the time this kind of stuff ends up in a museum (doesnt it?) and is meant to celibrate and honor those that gave their lives for their ship not to melt down the booty and make a buck. It would be a shame (and a sham) if these artifacts would be locked away somewhere, either in someone's attic or in some coast guard storage closet.

I do understand and respect our need to honor the dead and taking special care when human remains are concerned but the best way to honor the dead may very well be to bring up some key artifacts, display them as part of an exhibit to inform the community about this tragedy and the lives lost.

The divers I know are some of the most environmently sensitive/friendly and ethical folks around. I wouldnot dive with someone I didnt trust and that does not respect the grace and power of the sea (shoot in an emergency, I may have to trust them with my life) It takes a special kind of diver to enjoy the cool waters and limited visibility dives off the rocky coast's of new england...(must be somehow related to being a red sox fan, gluton for punishment)

granted if there are regulations which this group broke they should have to make ammends.

 

[DivePartner1]

“I believe that any military vessel remains property of the goverment. If that is the case they can regulate salvage/removal. I don't believe thay can keep you from diving on it though.”

Well, they can make it a crime. Try to dive the USS Arizona (or the Royal Oak in Scapa Flow) and see what happens. The only issue is enforcement, but if the laws get traction fishermen or others who would rather have divers off the wrecks will surely oblige the Coast Guard.

“You'd think diver's are the evil spawn of the satan or something.” In 20 years I've had a number of legal and lobbied clients express this sentiment, usually after the pendulum of public sentiment had swung irrevocably away from them.

“never buy the desecration of a graveyard bit. It's okay when "scientists" and "historians" go down on a wreck for "research" but everyday common joe can't? Total BS! As long as nobody is bringing up body parts or bones I see nothing wrong with bringing up souvenirs or potential museum objects. If divers don't bring the stuff up it'll just lie down there to deteriorate.”

This is precisely the attitude that is driving the government to criminalize wreck diving. Where was the dive industry when the Navy, USGC, EPA, NOAA and DOJ were promoting this law?

 

[Chebby]

The government claims the divers with the Boston Sea Rovers plundered the Lightship Nantucket and desecrated a gravesite last year when dive team Capt. Erik Takakjian led a team that took a 1,200-pound bronze bell, the ship's helm, telegraph and other artifacts.

Of course the government would never desecrate a gravesite, right?

 

[ScubaNorth]

Hey don't forget we are the government and laws protect the rights of everyone (well that's one theory). Great point Chebby That wasn't just plain wrong it was in violation of a laundry list of international laws and treaties. If the DOJ had any brains they just would have confiscated the items and let the Divers try to recover them. That way the burden of proof and cost shifts to the divers. In a criminal case what would actaul happen is a slap on the wrist and at huge expense (way more than they can sell a boat for). I have to say this would make me think twice about notifying anyone of a find, sad but true.

 

[augk]

I agree with ScubaNorth,
You know I read it somewhere something like "Of The People By The People" or something like that. As long as they don't disturb any remains and show proper respect I don’t see a problem.

 

[MSilvia]

Massachusetts does have a bureau for registering finds, and they have a permitting process that for the most part seems pretty sensible and straightforward. Of course, military vessels are probably outside their jurisdiction, but if you recovered artifacts from an unknown vessel for which you hold a MBUAR recon permit in a legitimate effort to identify what the vessel is, it might be a different situation legally even if it turns out to be military. I wouldn't be suprised if you had to surrender the artifacts, but I doubt you'd be prosecuted.

 

[ScubaNorth]

This link is to a pretty great article from our friends in NJ. They have a pretty nice site with a lot of good information.

http://njscuba.net/artifacts/misc_salvage_law.html

If you are a serious wreck diver I have to agree with MSilvia the proceedure seems fairly straight forward. If you are a casual wreck diver well you should not be going in the places artifacts are usually found (for your own good). The wrecks have less to fear from me than the lobsters do. Well except the ole' Field and Sea and the Saab I am still looking for the Bell from those two.

This is not a judgement on the Rover folks as I am 100% ignorant of the circumstance involved in the whole mess. Innocent until proven guilty, not the media stand of Guilty until conviction.

 

[MSilvia]

Well except the ole' Field and Sea and the Saab I am still looking for the Bell from those two.

Yeah... the horn from the Saab would be quite a trophy.

 

[DivePartner1]

By JOAO FERREIRA, Standard-Times staff writer
March 20, 2005.

FAIRHAVEN -- . . . Last year, a diving crew out of Fairhaven recovered an enormous bronze bell and several other artifacts from the shipwreck of the Lightship Nantucket with pomp and circumstance. Newspapers covered the feat, which came about after six years of investigative work by the Boston Sea Rovers, led by Capt. Eric J. Takakjian.

Last week, the federal government filed a lawsuit demanding the return of the artifacts recovered from the deadly 1934 shipwreck 50 miles south of Nantucket. The lawsuit alleges that six divers removed artifacts from the shipwreck even after the Coast Guard refused in 1999 to allow them to disturb the underwater grave.

Capt. Takakjian last week said that all artifacts have been returned to the government. "It looks like they're going to drop the complaint," said Capt. Takakjian of Fairhaven. "We had to agree not to dive the wreck again in the future.

. . .

He said the suit stems from his misinterpretation of a 1999 Coast Guard
letter in response to his proposal to recover items from the wreck. He said he thought the Coast Guard said it had no funds and no plan to recover the artifacts. . . .

The Sea Rovers, a nonprofit group of underwater explorers, went ahead with the recovery at their own expense.

Their work caught the attention of Marty Krzywicki, founder of the USCG
Lightship Sailors Association, who informed the Coast Guard. "Projects like this should never happen," Mr. Krzywicki is quoted in lawsuit documents. "From a very personal standpoint, these people are desecrating a gravesite of my brother lightship sailors who died in honor."

. . .

 

[Lil' Irish Temper]

By JOAO FERREIRA, Standard-Times staff writer
March 20, 2005.

FAIRHAVEN -- . . . Last year, a diving crew out of Fairhaven recovered an enormous bronze bell and several other artifacts from the shipwreck of the Lightship Nantucket with pomp and circumstance. Newspapers covered the feat, which came about after six years of investigative work by the Boston Sea Rovers, led by Capt. Eric J. Takakjian.

Last week, the federal government filed a lawsuit demanding the return of the artifacts recovered from the deadly 1934 shipwreck 50 miles south of Nantucket. The lawsuit alleges that six divers removed artifacts from the shipwreck even after the Coast Guard refused in 1999 to allow them to disturb the underwater grave.

Capt. Takakjian last week said that all artifacts have been returned to the government. "It looks like they're going to drop the complaint," said Capt. Takakjian of Fairhaven. "We had to agree not to dive the wreck again in the future.

. . .

He said the suit stems from his misinterpretation of a 1999 Coast Guard
letter in response to his proposal to recover items from the wreck. He said he thought the Coast Guard said it had no funds and no plan to recover the artifacts. . . .

The Sea Rovers, a nonprofit group of underwater explorers, went ahead with the recovery at their own expense.

Their work caught the attention of Marty Krzywicki, founder of the USCG
Lightship Sailors Association, who informed the Coast Guard. "Projects like this should never happen," Mr. Krzywicki is quoted in lawsuit documents. "From a very personal standpoint, these people are desecrating a gravesite of my brother lightship sailors who died in honor."

. . .

I wonder if they dove the site one last time to replace the stuff or did they just pull up to the site and chuck it over the side. The latter being the safe & simple way. Anyone know?