My AN/DP/Helitrox course

[uncfnp]

All of that was 100% covered in my Nitrox class. Now I will fully admit that I completely forgot all of that probably hours after taking the class — and that was probably no doubt also because I don’t think we spent 15 minutes of class time on it. It’s not really an issue with 32%, like ever. Of course, I didn’t take that newfangled computer only Nitrox class… I want to say that I took Nitrox in 2006? 2007? So it wasn’t like it was forever ago. (Though maybe the fact that I think 13 years ago isn’t that long ago just demonstrates my age…. Where does the time go?)

To me, the advanced Nitrox class could just as easily be relabeled Nitrox refresher class. Of course, no one would pay for that! (Or maybe, given the computer only classes, it should be called old school Nitrox class? ) It really is necessary, though: because of all of those things that have no application at 30% that suddenly have lots of application at 100%. But it’s not much of a value as a standalone class if you had a decent Nitrox class.

From a math perspective, Trimix class is almost the same as well. The math is the same, you just have to do it twice: once for oxygen and once for helium. I imagine that’s probably true for the helium portion of @Marie13 class, too. Actually, now that I think about it, maybe that’s why she was commenting about the math? That really would change the math from straight up Nitrox class.

It is not a different class but an “advanced” class. Think of basic vs advanced algebra, both at its core are algebra but one adds onto the other. Advanced nitrox is similar. It builds onto the basic nitrox course. And as with most instruction, a lot depends on the instructor. The manual is just an outline. It’s the instructor that gives the course its meat.

A large part of AN is developing a more technical mindset and a respect for the added risk of diving with pure oxygen. No, there is not a lot of skill development but there should be a lot of mind development, a way of thinking and approaching diving. The only real skill needed is the ability to hold a stop and switching to the right gas for that stop. And the awareness what could happen if you don’t.

It’s true though that a stand alone AN is not the right choice for most divers.

Edit. There is at least one other skill taught, how to rig and sling a deco tank.

 

[Marie13]

It is not a different class but an “advanced” class. Think of basic vs advanced algebra, both at its core are algebra but one adds onto the other. Advanced nitrox is similar. It builds onto the basic nitrox course. And as with most instruction, a lot depends on the instructor. The manual is just an outline. It’s the instructor that gives the course its meat.

A large part of AN is developing a more technical mindset and a respect for the added risk of diving with pure oxygen. No, there is not a lot of skill development but there should be a lot of mind development, a way of thinking and approaching diving. The only real skill needed is the ability to hold a stop and switching to the right gas for that stop. And the awareness what could happen if you don’t.

It’s true though that a stand alone AN is not the right choice for most divers.

50% is the most common deco gas here, at least among the divers I know.

 

[tmassey]

It is not a different class but an “advanced” class. Think of basic vs advanced algebra, both at its core are algebra but one adds onto the other. Advanced nitrox is similar. It builds onto the basic nitrox course. And as with most instruction, a lot depends on the instructor. The manual is just an outline. It’s the instructor that gives the course its meat.

A large part of AN is developing a more technical mindset and a respect for the added risk of diving with pure oxygen. No, there is not a lot of skill development but there should be a lot of mind development, a way of thinking and approaching diving. The only real skill needed is the ability to hold a stop and switching to the right gas for that stop. And the awareness what could happen if you don’t.

It’s true though that a stand alone AN is not the right choice for most divers.

None of the stops and switching are covered in Advanced Nitrox. As the person above said, there were barely 2 sentence fragments about that in the entire advanced nitrox book. And I certainly learned new techniques and formulas in algebra two that were not taught in algebra one: it wasn’t just the same stuff repeated ‘with a different focus’. All of the new stuff in AN are all in the DP portion!

Really, advanced nitrox is in no way a new class, if you had a mathematics-based nitrox class. In our modern world, where you may not have had that, well then ‘advanced’ nitrox certainly has a place. And as part of AN/DP the reminders had value, no doubt about it. But it’s such a half step to nowhere, it really shouldn’t be its own class. When paired with Deco Procedures, there’s plenty new to learn. And given the extreme overlap, it certainly makes sense to put Helitrox in there at the same time. (At least with the new TDI limits.)

Of course AN/DP/Helitrox is a terrible class name. Maybe they should come up with a nice, short, reasonable name. Maybe…

Technical Diver Level 1?

(Did I write that entire reply just to make that joke? Yes. Yes, I did.)

 

[uncfnp]

None of the stops and switching are covered in Advanced Nitrox. As the person above said, there were barely 2 sentence fragments about that in the entire advanced nitrox book. And I certainly learned new techniques and formulas in algebra two that were not taught in algebra one: it wasn’t just the same stuff repeated ‘with a different focus’. All of the new stuff in are all in the DP portion!

Really, advanced nitrox is in no way a new class, if you had a mathematics-based nitrox class. In our modern world, where you may not have had that, well then ‘advanced’ nitrox certainly has a place. And as part of AN/DP the reminders had value, no doubt about it. But it’s such a half step to nowhere, it really shouldn’t be its own class. When paired with Deco Procedures, there’s plenty new to learn. And given the extreme overlap, it certainly makes sense to put Helitrox in there at the same time. (At least with the new TDI limits.)

Of course AN/DP/Helitrox is a terrible class name. Maybe they should come up with a nice, short, reasonable name. Maybe…

Technical Diver Level 1?

(Did I write that entire reply just to make that joke? Yes. Yes, I did.)

So you are advocating that a basic nitrox course should qualify you for diving up to 99 percent nitrox?

Or are you stating that AN should not qualify you for O2?

Because if AN course adds nothing to the mix it has to be one or the other.

 

[lowviz]

A large part of AN is developing a more technical mindset and a respect for the added risk of diving with pure oxygen. No, there is not a lot of skill development but there should be a lot of mind development, a way of thinking and approaching diving.

Beautifully stated.

...//... It’s true though that a stand alone AN is not the right choice for most divers.

True, but it is perfect for some...

 

[MichaelMc]

The TDI AN book adds a bit of talk about diving for a mission and your base skills not changing nor your performance of them by changes to the mission. But it is not much more than that sentence there.

Edit. There is at least one other skill taught, how to rig and sling a deco tank.

There is nothing in the TDI AN book about rigging or slinging a deco tank nor listed in the skills. Though you might well switch to 100% at the safety stop. But nothing on setting up for that.

It's fine. It's the 'making sure you get the math and O2 toxicity' version of nitrox. Not just the 'dive 32% and your limits change' version. I think it should likely be that plus gas switch, convulsion rescue response, and tight depth control. But it is not.

It warns about high O2 risks. Which they do not really say very well, just that the tank needs to be clean.

Saying "The use of oxygen and high oxygen concentration mixtures does carry some increased risk of equipment related issues. Always turn valves on slowly." is not the same as saying "O2 makes things go boom if done wrong". Really not. It is the blandest possible description of O2 safety concerns.

ETA: There is more treatment of Pulmonary exposure and OTU. I've learned OTU before but it might have been in DAN O2 administration.

 

[Mike1967]

The one we all know about is keeping your oxygen pressure above ~1.4 ata so that you don't convulse.

Do you mean below?

 

[Marie13]

Stopped by the shop this afternoon on my way back into town. Showed instructor a few screenshots I pulled from the video this weekend. He was very happy with the results. : )

We tweaked my harness a bit to pull the plate a bit higher to see he that helps with valve drills.

 

[lowviz]

Do you mean below?

Yes. I most certainly do. Thanks for pointing that out.

Edit: My previous post has been corrected.

 

[uncfnp]

The TDI AN book adds a bit of talk about diving for a mission and your base skills not changing nor your performance of them by changes to the mission. But it is not much more than that sentence there.


There is nothing in the TDI AN book about rigging or slinging a deco tank nor listed in the skills. Though you might well switch to 100% at the safety stop. But nothing on setting up for that.

It's fine. It's the 'making sure you get the math and O2 toxicity' version of nitrox. Not just the 'dive 32% and your limits change' version. I think it should likely be that plus gas switch, convulsion rescue response, and tight depth control. But it is not.

It warns about high O2 risks. Which they do not really say very well, just that the tank needs to be clean.

Saying "The use of oxygen and high oxygen concentration mixtures does carry some increased risk of equipment related issues. Always turn valves on slowly." is not the same as saying "O2 makes things go boom if done wrong". Really not. It is the blandest possible description of O2 safety concerns.

ETA: There is more treatment of Pulmonary exposure and OTU. I've learned OTU before but it might have been in DAN O2 administration.

I admit to some confusion here and I do know I had a very good instructor but you simply can not judge a course by the manual alone.

Are you saying the course does not have you dive a deco tank? Not hold a stop while switching over to the deco tank? Not rigging said tank? Not knowing how this will affect your dive plan?

(Sorry Marie13 if this is hijacking your thread)