My 1st Incident

[Spg01]

I think I drive my buddies nuts.......on decent I am always asking "OK", "OK"......"OK" starting at about 8 feet till we get to the bottom.......then again at the bottom.....

Even going down a line, I will stop every 10-15 feet turn around and ask "OK"......and will not go on until I get an "OK" back........

My theory is that it is first 5 minutes of a dive when you find out if there is an issue.....mask seal, freeflow, leaking drysuit, etc........

Of course, with my close dive buddies, I ralax a bit......

M

Dive and let Dive.......

I am guess I was not the best buddy in this respect. But I wonder why he waited so long if his mask was leaking. He said the mask seal was over his hood and I think you would catch that in the first few feet, not 50 feet.

I will work on my descent with a buddy. I guess I was just to used to dropping in 20' of water and not being a big deal. But dropping in the depth we were takes a few more steps.

 

[Teamcasa]

I am not sure if the mask thing was real or not, but he was freaked. I though he would be able to handle it, but I guess not. Maybe he is not ready for that depth yet in those conditions? Vis was about 10-15'. I did not think we planned a dangerous dive or that either of us was in danger, until he wanted to surface.

He did finally talk me into a 2nd dive, even though I was not so sure about it. I ended up dropping us rather early in about 20' so we would not have the same problem.

A comprehensive pre-dive plan helps when diving new sites with new buddies.

However, the main point is that panic or some sense of dread happens often early in the dive and more often in low or bad vis. The disorientation coupled with an unexpected depth can make some new divers want to bolt to the surface and you are both fortunate there were no issues.

In the future discuss the what if scenarios and the plan for mask floods, equalizing or gear problems. Slow your decents, stay close and face to face. Flash and recieve the OK every 3-4 feet. If you sense panic in your buddy, ask him and be calm and reassuring, but most of all - stop. Let him calm down or just thunb the dive and discuss the issues without recrimination. Sooner or later, you will have either a very good dive buddy or you may just need a new one.

 

[openmindOW]

Thank you again, Spg01.

Obviously, I have never met your dive buddy, but I wonder if he was a bit over-weighted. 30 lbs is a lot of weight - even with a 7mm suit. It is conceivable that the hood might have contributed to the leak into his mask. We'll never know.

 

[duskdiver]

It looks like he freaked out and just lost it!
Faked "mask" problems are number 2, on number 1 we have the so called "ear problem", on number 3 "I have or had a cold",...sounds to me this diver was just not ready for this dive and should get some proper training or quit diving.
I admire you for trying to help your buddy, but you should have stayed away from him, and from a distance try to calm him down.
Good lesson though, happy you both are fine.

 

[TheScubaBOB]

I'm currently in the middle of Rescue Diver (did class room last night, Pool will be tomorrow evening & Open Water will be Sunday).

Here's my observations based on what is posted here.

If it really was a mask seal over hood issue:

A buddy check at the surface would have found it. When diving with a hood I always ask my buddy if my mask seal is messed by my hood BEFORE venting my BCD.

On descent...

Buddies should be close enough to signal and see signals in the event of an issue arising.

At depth...

Once he realized he had a problem he failed to STOP, THINK and then ACT.

Had he signaled a problem to you, you could have helped by pulling the hood out of his mask seal. Then a simple mask clear would fix him right up.


Regarding the way events transpired:

Once he grabbed onto you like that he was a panicked diver. Actually if you had a good view of him just prior to the grab you would have seen him coming and could have backed away.

When he bolted for the surface and dumping your air wasn't enough to stop the ascent you should have done one of two things:

1) grabbed his dump valve to vent some of his air.
or
2) get free from his grip and assend at a safe rate.

I doubt I'd get back in the water with a diver who doesn't know they panicked and endangered both our lives.

 

[ligersandtions]

I am guess I was not the best buddy in this respect. But I wonder why he waited so long if his mask was leaking. He said the mask seal was over his hood and I think you would catch that in the first few feet, not 50 feet.

I will work on my descent with a buddy. I guess I was just to used to dropping in 20' of water and not being a big deal. But dropping in the depth we were takes a few more steps.

That's one of those things about doing a lot of shore diving....you get very used to dropping down into 20 feet of water, seeing the bottom, and being ready to orient yourself completely. To drop down into 80 feet of water, expecting to drop into 30 feet of water, in less than stellar vis, can play with one's mind a lot.

I think you did well. Your buddy, however, needs to understand that it's better to deal with issues underwater, rather than bolting to the surface. Is he on SB? Has he done a lot of reading/researching about diving? I, too, am surprised he didn't notice his mask at the start of the descent....maybe it was one of the issues he was having that compounded, forcing him into panic-mode....and it was the easiest one to blame rather than admitting that he freaked himself out.

Either way, stick to some relatively simple sites when you dive with him....and when you dive Vet's, drop early rather than late. The swim underwater is better than a surface swim....and at least that way you will know you're not dropping into 80 feet of water!

 

[Goindrinkn]

A lot of good information here. I'd agree with the suggestions to go on to Rescue diver when you are able to. It will help you gain some skills to assist when something like this happens, most of all recognize the issues before they turn into panic. I think there is a theme here that your buddie was a newer diver. That's a bit inexperienced, but not necessarily a bad diver. However he made less than the best decision. The important thing is that no one got hurt, and that you learned something valueable from the situation. Recently I was with my divebuddy (wife) at 110ft when she looked at me wide eyed and signaled UP - NOW! It was thanks to both of our training and plenty of diveing discussions that we were able to slow the situation down and take care of the issue. The great thing here is that you mitagated the risk and added a level of comfort by dropping in the second time in a shallower area.

We're all macho men (and ladies) and rarely does one want to say this dive is just a "little" beyond my comfort zone. Part of being a good dive buddy (and it comes with the training) is knowing where the persons limits are. There's a thin line between a dive that is a bit challenging and one that is pushing the limits.

Again; kudos for using the training you have had and some good old common sense to minimize the situation! And hopefully you and your buddy will both learn something for the event.

 

[bsee65]

When we finally got to the surface and asked what the hell that was all about. He said his mask did not seal and he could not see anything and his eyes were burning and since things did not feel right he wanted to get to the surface. I did not agree with that theory, and he obviously did not take the same class that I did. So we floated at the surface for a while and he calmed down and neither of us died.

We ended up swiming towards shore and dropping down again and hit bottom at about 25', which made him feel much better. We finished the dive and got out of the water without any further incidents. I tried to talk to him a little more about how BAD it was to try and shoot to the surface from 60' and all he could say is thing weren't going right and he was not comfortable and could not see.

This would be the key for me. He screwed up and reacted badly. While still in the water, he could have been too hyped to get the message. After the fact, he should be able to objectively look at the situation and admit he screwed up. If he still doesn't get it, then he will be potentially dangerous to continue diving with. If he still thinks he did the right thing, then the potential is there that he will do it again the next time something isn't quite right. If you guys share an instructor and LDS, maybe you could relay the details to that person and have the message delivered to him from another direction and a position of some authority.

 

[Spg01]

That's one of those things about doing a lot of shore diving....you get very used to dropping down into 20 feet of water, seeing the bottom, and being ready to orient yourself completely. To drop down into 80 feet of water, expecting to drop into 30 feet of water, in less than stellar vis, can play with one's mind a lot.

I think you did well. Your buddy, however, needs to understand that it's better to deal with issues underwater, rather than bolting to the surface. Is he on SB? Has he done a lot of reading/researching about diving? I, too, am surprised he didn't notice his mask at the start of the descent....maybe it was one of the issues he was having that compounded, forcing him into panic-mode....and it was the easiest one to blame rather than admitting that he freaked himself out.

Either way, stick to some relatively simple sites when you dive with him....and when you dive Vet's, drop early rather than late. The swim underwater is better than a surface swim....and at least that way you will know you're not dropping into 80 feet of water!

I do not believe he is on SB. I have shown him the site a few time, but have never really talked about how much time he has spent looking around.

I sure will stick to the easier shore dives with him. But I think I will have to talk with him before the next dive about what happened. We only talked about it once or twice that day very briefly. But then I don't want to beat him down with it either, I just want to make sure he realizes how bad things could have gone.

 

[Spg01]

This would be the key for me. He screwed up and reacted badly. While still in the water, he could have been too hyped to get the message. After the fact, he should be able to objectively look at the situation and admit he screwed up. If he still doesn't get it, then he will be potentially dangerous to continue diving with. If he still thinks he did the right thing, then the potential is there that he will do it again the next time something isn't quite right. If you guys share an instructor and LDS, maybe you could relay the details to that person and have the message delivered to him from another direction and a position of some authority.

While we did not share an instructor, he recently joined our dive club. Today at the shop I was asked about my weekend and I brought it up that I made a dive with him and that I probably would not take him back there anytime soon. I got asked a little about conditions, but not about anything that might have happened. But maybe when I get tanks for the weekend I can expand on it.

Like I have said, I don't want to beat this to death. But at the same time I still think it is an important issue if he is going to continue to dive, especially if it is with me.