Moral dilemma

[Ber Rabbit]

Like the others said, every situation is different but the odds of you getting DCS here are small. I always tell my students "You're better off bent than embolised so BREATHE and deal with the situation as best you can."

When you caught her power inflating the first time you should have taken the inflator away from her and taken charge of buoyancy management. You might have been able to reassure her with an "up" signal and keeping her eyes focused on yours. You also need to make sure your diver is breathing; don't let them ascend holding their breath even if it means punching them in the gut to force an exhale. The trick is to notice the signs of the panic cycle when they start and to intervene before the diver is no longer capable of self-control or rationality.

Having been the near panicked diver myself (I freaked about everything when learning to dive and didn't pass the check-outs my first try) I can tell you it's reassuring to know someone is in control of the situation and they are taking you where you want to go even though it seems like it's taking forever.
Ber :lilbunny:

 

[BIGUMs]

Hi everyone, I've just started my DM candidature and over the weekend, I was with a group of OW students. One of the students inhaled some water through her nose and panicked a little, and the instructor tasked me to bring her up to the surface. We started ascending at about 12metre (abt 40feet?), and then I heard her power inflating. I quickly shot my hand out and started deflating her BC, while communicating to her not to inflate while ascending, telling her to keep her finger on the deflate button instead. As I was ascending, I was checking the rate of ascent, dumping air as well as keeping my eye on her. At 3m, she power inflated again, except this time, I didn't hear nor see her do it and before I could react, we'd spiralled to the surface (found our that she power inflated after I asked her). Frankly, I was rather peeved at myself for not being more observant.

I was speaking to some friends who are DMs/instructors, and they reckoned that I should preserve myself and not let her take me up, whereas my mentor told me that I could lock myself to her, flare myself out and then grab hold of her deflator. Which means I could still suffer from DCS, depending on how much time it took me to rectify the situation. What do you think is the right thing to do? It's a no-win situation in that while I save my own life, I'm gonna find it hard to live with myself that I couldn't save my diver.

Had something similar happen while I was still a DM candidate. This was a young teenage girl, actually the daughter of one of the instructors. She didn't panic or anything but she had an equipment issue and was leaking air badly. Being a DM Candidate and not a full DM my intructor and I brought her up together. Granted she didnt panic and was frankly, for her or any other age, quite well composed. Once on the surface she and I swam to shore and had her gear repaired on the spot, can't remember what was wrong with but it was minor...an O-ring or something I think.

After the dive my instructor and I discussed what I might have done had she displayed signs of panic and I guess my whole point is, I would have tried too rescue her but also realised that I must not get injured in the process.

It splits your resources in half. What if you were the only diver on site trained in rescue techniques? What if it was you and your buddy alone, if you both got hurt who would know? Who would go for help?

Considering those questions, should you really risk injuring yourself? Would you and your diver be better off if you stayed healthy and capable of performing the rescue that would be needed if the situation were to become life threatening?

Just some of the "what ifs" to think about...

your situation is different than mine was and neither was life threatening, but they both illustrate the descision making process pretty well.

Assuming a situation that the risk was seriouis and real Im not sure what I would do. My brain says dont get hurt yourself, everyone will be better off with one more person able to help instead of one more person in need of help. But then there is another side that says "hey this person will get hurt and I am in a position to maybe prevent it" I guess you have to try and you have to understand that you might fail. Thats why we are taught in the OW class that we have responcibility for our own diving actions.

Tough descion either way. Hopefully you/I/any of us never find out in the real world what we would do.

Brad

 

[Lead_carrier]

Hi everyone, I've just started my DM candidature and over the weekend, I was with a group of OW students. One of the students inhaled some water through her nose and panicked a little, and the instructor tasked me to bring her up to the surface. We started ascending at about 12metre (abt 40feet?), and then I heard her power inflating. I quickly shot my hand out and started deflating her BC, while communicating to her not to inflate while ascending, telling her to keep her finger on the deflate button instead. As I was ascending, I was checking the rate of ascent, dumping air as well as keeping my eye on her. At 3m, she power inflated again, except this time, I didn't hear nor see her do it and before I could react, we'd spiralled to the surface (found our that she power inflated after I asked her). Frankly, I was rather peeved at myself for not being more observant.

Don't be peeved at yourself, you are a dm candidate. You are in a learning curve and next time you will know how to better react. I do agree with some of the answers so far in that you should not have been tasked with bringing up a panicked diver as a dm student, but you were and you've learned from it. Personally, if I have a panicked diver to bring up, I will have one hand on a dump valve on their bc so I have some control over the ascent rate. They inflate, I deflate. If they don't have a dump on their bc, then I will take over their inflator and discuss the whys once we get safely on the surface.

One important lesson to remember, regardless of what some may think. No matter how well a student has been taught or trained. When confronted with a problem during ow checkout, the brain says get to the surface NOW, and inflating seems to be the logical choice to a panicing diver.

 

[nereas]

Hi everyone, I've just started my DM candidature and over the weekend, I was with a group of OW students. One of the students inhaled some water through her nose and panicked a little, and the instructor tasked me to bring her up to the surface. We started ascending at about 12metre (abt 40feet?), and then I heard her power inflating. I quickly shot my hand out and started deflating her BC, while communicating to her not to inflate while ascending, telling her to keep her finger on the deflate button instead. As I was ascending, I was checking the rate of ascent, dumping air as well as keeping my eye on her. At 3m, she power inflated again, except this time, I didn't hear nor see her do it and before I could react, we'd spiralled to the surface (found our that she power inflated after I asked her). Frankly, I was rather peeved at myself for not being more observant.

I was speaking to some friends who are DMs/instructors, and they reckoned that I should preserve myself and not let her take me up, whereas my mentor told me that I could lock myself to her, flare myself out and then grab hold of her deflator. Which means I could still suffer from DCS, depending on how much time it took me to rectify the situation. What do you think is the right thing to do? It's a no-win situation in that while I save my own life, I'm gonna find it hard to live with myself that I couldn't save my diver.

As a D/M you are now learning to assist individual students one at a time. After you have done this for awhile, then you will be ready for an ITC/IDC where you will further learn to instruct an entire class up to a dozen at a time.

This is really good practice for you.

Some people are big on self preservation. My view is that such people are not cut out to be DMs nor scuba instructors.

Other people are brave and protective of others in their care. These are the kind of folks that make great DMs and scuba instructors.

Sounds like your mentor is a good man (or good woman).

When you take a student up to the surface, it is best to grip their left shoulder strap with your right hand, and never let go. As you learned from your recent experience, you do need to pay careful attention to everything the student does. That was a good lesson for you.

A student like this one, who does not take direction, is a likely candidate for a scuba death at some point. Your instructor will need to evaluate that before he certifies him/her. No instructor wants a dead former student on their list of graduates. It is embarrassing.

You, however, did fine, considering the circumstances. It could have been a lot worse.

 

[nereas]

Don't be peeved at yourself, you are a dm candidate. You are in a learning curve and next time you will know how to better react. I do agree with some of the answers so far in that you should not have been tasked with bringing up a panicked diver as a dm student, but you were and you've learned from it. Personally, if I have a panicked diver to bring up, I will have one hand on a dump valve on their bc so I have some control over the ascent rate. They inflate, I deflate. If they don't have a dump on their bc, then I will take over their inflator and discuss the whys once we get safely on the surface.

One important lesson to remember, regardless of what some may think. No matter how well a student has been taught or trained. When confronted with a problem during ow checkout, the brain says get to the surface NOW, and inflating seems to be the logical choice to a panicing diver.

I am guessing that the instructor has a great read on this DMC, and therefore correctly judged that he/she would be able to handle the situation, as she/he indeed did.

I also agree that it is a bit of a stretch to give a DMC such a dangerous situation.

But I would defer to the instructor.

 

[alan_lee]

Thanks for the supportive posts as well as the constructive advice. I DEFINITELY have heaps more to learn (I believe that one never stops learning) before I'll become even close to being a good DM. Hearing the different opinions definitely helps shape the kind of DM I wanna be.

 

[Michael Schlink]

When a student is heading to the surface you have two obvious responsibilities.
Make sure they don't go up too fast and hurt themselves and make sure you don't go up too fast and hurt yourself. You solve both problems by CONTROLLING the rate of ascent. Once a student is "heading up" I take over control of everything. My attitude is the student is beyond being trained at this point because their focus is rather narrow at that time. Let them get to the surface, safely, and then we'll get back on track. Rarely have I needed to "beach" someone after "scurrying" to the surface, in most all cases a quick discussion as to why we have found both of ourselves at the surface, instead of problem solving U/W, and it's back down to start again.
If you're a DMC, and not a CA I'm not so sure it's a good idea to be put in this situation, just yet, but I wasn't there so I can't comment.
BTW, get used to this probelm as you will see it again.

 

[Tigerman]

...
Some people are big on self preservation. My view is that such people are not cut out to be DMs nor scuba instructors.

Other people are brave and protective of others in their care. These are the kind of folks that make great DMs and scuba instructors.
...

A dead DM/instructor is of absolutely ZERO value to a diver in need of help, right?
Self preservation and bravery is two things that goes together, but there is a fine line between bravery and being foolhardy, which DONT go together with self preservation.

 

[Lead_carrier]

Some people are big on self preservation. My view is that such people are not cut out to be DMs nor scuba instructors.

Other people are brave and protective of others in their care. These are the kind of folks that make great DMs and scuba instructors.

I'm as brave as I have to be and extremely, probably to a fault, of the students in my charge. I am also big on self preservation and survival. If I'm injured or worse then I am of very little or no use to anyone that needs my help. I'll do my best to help before, during, and after the fact but I WON'T take the bullet for you. I don't know you that well.

 

[RiverRat]

As a practicing DM I've learned it's a battlefield out there. Most of the issues I see are directly related to training "gaps". You just don't know what the hell you're going to run into when you show up to help out a class. If you have a big class with multiple issues at the same time and are maxing out the Instructor/DM to student ratios then things can get out of hand. To be honest I hate assisting with those "cluster......" classes. But I do my best and have learned everything and anything can and will happen. You just have to know when to take charge of the situation and deal with it. Multitasking is a must in the bigger classes. After awhile you realize the rules get bent a little sometimes. It's not planned. But **** happens. As a DM you have to be prepared to step into your Instructor's shoes for a bit until the issues get under control. Of course this is all dependant on the Instructor/s you are working with. In some classes the DM does not do a heck of a lot. The Instrucor is on top of his game. In other classes I've felt like I wanted to whack the guy in the head. Fun stuff.