Manual/Oral inflation technique question.

[Jim Lapenta]

Just one of the reasons I do not recommend the set ups. In my AOW class they are not permitted unless the student can demonstrate proficiency with it;s use before class. I will train someone on it's use if they insist on buying one but urge bungeed octos and long hose (or conventional set ups) even for recreational jacket set ups. In my book I encourage divers who are considering one to make sure the shop will provide free in water training with the purchase. Especially if they have never used one before or been trained on standard gear. Used them and also do not care for the big bulb hanging down off the end of my inflator.

I was unaware of this issue with them as the ones I have used and the people I have dived with that used them did not have this problem. So thanks for another reason to put in my gear lecture as to why they are not the best choice. If it takes two hands to work it or the buttons are confusing why would you want one?

In a rescue class I did last year even after looking at the gear set ups of all the divers I had students that had trouble finding the right button on a victims Air II type set up after bringing them up from depth and in dealing with a panicked diver. No issues with conventional inflators. They saw another con to these things when trying to inflate the bc of a panicked diver and spent valuable time looking for the right button. Imagine someone who has never actually worked one trying to assist a diver having one. Not a good time.

 

[BoltSnap]

Jim,

In all my years using the AIRII I had no problems with it at all nor have my students or customers. Training for any new/unfamiliar piece of dive gear is always done/encouraged not just for AIR II but also for even the most standard piece of gear including octos. The Air II doesn't require the use of two hands at all, at least not more so than a standard BC LPI. I see some people using two hands to use the BC LPI, one hand to hold it and the other to inflate, but we don't blame it on the BC LPI either.

For those that are unfamiliar with Air II's, there are two buttons to work with. One big button for the oral inflator and smaller round button for the power inflator. It one presses the wrong one, it is the other one for sure. I suppose that students will look at it from different angles and if these folks were told by their instructor that the Air II is the greatest thing, they will believe it and act accordingly. If they were told otherwise, then they would believe the opposite.

BTW, isn't part of rescue ditching the weight belt of the victim as first measure to establish buoyancy?

 

[BoltSnap]

BTW, doesn't Scubapro have a new enhanced version of AirII now? Is it any different?

 

[Dr Wu]

I am curious if anyone else has had this issue and/or seen the "palm cover" method used and what your opinion on either method is?

Looks like you are alone in having that issue.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Yes it is on the surface. But we also may use the victims BC to add just a bit of air if necessary at depth. Here it is likely that divers will be wearing exposure suits so ditching weight at depth is a no no. But it is also likely that a diver is seriously overweighted (they still like to plant em round here) so the rescuers BC may not have enough lift. The rescuer must also be able to orally inflate a victims BC if they are OOA and still negative. For someone not trained on an air two that can be problematic. And I have seen recently air 2 type devices with 3 buttons on them. Don't know what that's about as it seems there are two inflators? The shop I teach with does not have them on BCs. They are therefore foreign to my students except in pics or the Sherwood shadows I have for lecture purposes. I do not see any real benefit to them as far as streamlining. They are more expensive than a standard octo.

While some resorts do have them many do not, they usually have different LP connections, and for the classes and skills I teach they are not the best choice. Try to do a horizontal air share from 90 feet to 50 feet and control your buoyancy while keeping contact with the vic. It can be done but is not optimal. That is an exercise on my AOW deep dive. In ow a no mask air share swim and ascent is also easier with a standard octo.I just don't see where they add much to a divers safety and to the ability for a buddy to assit. You may feel differently but as long as I see no obvious benefit I will continue to advise against them. Equipment needs to be chosen with your needs and that of your buddy's or anyone else's ability to assist should it be required. If a diver is not familiar with the device that ability is compromised.

I also wanted to add that if a diver is trained in it's use and proficient with it fine. But two ScubaPro shops I am familair with act like it's the greatest thing since sliced bread and push it hard. The divers will get training with it but only if they ask for it. it should be standard as part of the training. The real advantage seems to be that it turns a 400 dollar BC sale into a 600 dollar one or more.

I was cautioned against pointing out my preference not to recommend one during instructor training. And I guess that's why I choose to stay independent as well. I can recommend what I feel will best meet the needs of my students and their means to pay for it without the pressure of having to sell or recommend gear I do not believe in.

Jim,

In all my years using the AIRII I had no problems with it at all nor have my students or customers. Training for any new/unfamiliar piece of dive gear is always done/encouraged not just for AIR II but also for even the most standard piece of gear including octos. The Air II doesn't require the use of two hands at all, at least not more so than a standard BC LPI. I see some people using two hands to use the BC LPI, one hand to hold it and the other to inflate, but we don't blame it on the BC LPI either.

For those that are unfamiliar with Air II's, there are two buttons to work with. One big button for the oral inflator and smaller round button for the power inflator. It one presses the wrong one, it is the other one for sure. I suppose that students will look at it from different angles and if these folks were told by their instructor that the Air II is the greatest thing, they will believe it and act accordingly. If they were told otherwise, then they would believe the opposite.

BTW, isn't part of rescue ditching the weight belt of the victim as first measure to establish buoyancy?

 

[Gdaaym8z]

Thank you for all your responses. We actually train with the AIR 2 set up as well as conventional and weight belts as well. We want people to experience the variety of what they may encounter in the real world, ecspecially if renting gear.

I have never personally had an issue with the AIR 2 set up on my personal rec gear and this issue with the difference in teaching styles on the unit had me a little baffled. I'm thinking it must be technique that needs to be addressed.

After talking to my instructors on this it seems the issue falls mostly with woman and smaller/younger students that hand size and strength play a part with this equipment.

Thanks for all your comments.

 

[Laurie S.]

I have an Air 2 and have had it since my very first pool class. I've never had a problem using the manual inflate button. I like the system.

 

[redacted]

BTW, doesn't Scubapro have a new enhanced version of AirII now? Is it any different?

It is "restyled" which seems to mean the biggest difference is in the looks. Different shape body and button shape with the same interior parts. Closest thing to a functional change is the plastic cover is changed to a rubber cover making it harder to improvise a seat saver device. (We would not want those seats to not require an annual replacement.)

The Air2 (Scubapro BCD) user must realize that they have to press the manual inflate control all the way to the stop position to seal off the exhaust. Then there is no reason to cover the exhaust valve opening by hand. It does take a little practice as that button need only be pressed a little to operate the deflate function but must be pressed all the way in for inflate. The Scubaprio standard inflator is of a similar design - the deflate button must be pressed all the way to seal the exhaust opening and allow manual inflation. Conventional inflators require only partial depression of the manual (end) button to allow both deflate and inflate functions.

 

[Lead_carrier]

I've been training with and without the Air2 for a number of years. I actually use one, and during my classes, at various times, I also have an octo and bungeed necklace. Forgive me all, for I am not one of the politically correct. I try to make sure that everyone uses both so they can see what they will be dealing with. Some like it, some don't (same as on this board). When manually inflating, as stated earlier, make sure they press the center of the delate button fully. If not, then it will not inflate. There is no use in trying to cover the exhaust port with their other hand. If it has not been properly serviced, then that can be an issue also, the same as with a power inflator. They will all mess up. Show your student's both setups, let them use them and choose which they like.

 

[BoltSnap]

Lead_carrier,

What you mentioned is interesting. What we did in the past is to have one person, typically an AI/DM or Instructor, work with an Octo. based setup in class and have the students share air with him and vice versa. We wanted the students to know the different choices available for them once they step out in the real world. We had to choose a standard for our entry level classes but students needed to know that there is more than one way how to do things in the outside world. We emphasized, however, that they had to discuss with their buddy in advance their dive plan including air sharing procedures and to practice the OOA procedures frequently with their buddy especially when they are diving together for the first time and with different regulator and/or BC configurations.

It is interesting to note that the students will generally follow what their instructor told them what he/she liked better. The certified students will defend that choice vigorously later be it an Octo or Air II. I think that we are all influenced by the factors of our environment/experience and what was ingrained in our brains by our instructors/mentors way back then to a great extent (this is for the ones that still remember their instructors).