Making The Scuba Industry Better

[fisheater]

Thanks, now I know how to make the scuba industry better.

Get rid of all those damned vacation divers, you know the ones that spend their vacation and their $$$ to go on dive trips to warm water destinations once or twice a year. That's the problem, get rid of them and the industry is fixed. Thanks for your insight.

That's EXACTLY the solution.

Only, instead of getting "rid of" them, what we need to do is to have them become local divers in between their "dive trips to warm water destinations once or twice a year."

Convert them from "vacation divers" to "divers on vacation" and the industry will be just fine.

 

[Steve50]

yes because if you don't dive the way i do, or as often as I do, you are the problem

 

[dmoore19]

I can understand the desire to improve the quality of instruction. I get it. But that isn't new is it? All one needs to do to find that opinion is to read about any post on scubaboard. Got any other ideas?

I am still new, I am still learning. I did my certification dives here in cold water, in a pond that getting to 22' means digging a hole. I saw the wonderful artificial reef (discarded grocery cart) and the life underwater was breathtaking (crawdads). I would not say the local diving is what drives my desire to continue my participation. It is in fact the 2 trips per year that are far more inspiring.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

yes because if you don't dive the way i do, or as often as I do, you are the problem

No, the industry got greedy and wanted more cash from more people, that's the problem.
I don't blame the people participating, I blame the rule makers.
The standards never should have been watered down to accomodate a group that probably would have been better off finding a different activity. If they really want it they will work harder to pass a more rigorous course.
This isn't mountain biking or snow skiing. You don't just fall and then decide you don't want to do it anymore. You're underwater and if something goes wrong and you don't make it back to the surface you die.

 

[Akimbo]

Thanks, now I know how to make the scuba industry better.

Get rid of all those damned vacation divers, you know the ones that spend their vacation and their $$$ to go on dive trips to warm water destinations once or twice a year. That's the problem, get rid of them and the industry is fixed. Thanks for your insight.

Great idea, except I read somewhere that shooting them is frowned on

Seriously, I remember the disparity of training problem beginning in the mid-1960s. People would come back from the Caribbean from a one day course, insist the local dive shop treat them as qualified divers, get PO’d when they didn’t, and take their business elsewhere. Rather than create a separate classification, certifying agencies dumbed their standards down and the merit badge system was born.

I can see a classification for tropical vacation divers that restrict things like the environment (water temperature, distance offshore, and visibility), depth, and supervision level. That way, people can try and enjoy diving in relatively protected environments but not have the same basic certification that dive shops are obliged to offer in Maine. Divers that don’t want those restrictions could be sold a class that is much longer and incorporates what is learned through deep/decompression diving and Nitrox. Minimum diver competence will improve, their fear and trepidation will nearly disappear, and they will understand enough to prepare for more demanding dives.

 

[Mike Boswell]

Thanks, now I know how to make the scuba industry better.

Get rid of all those damned vacation divers, you know the ones that spend their vacation and their $$$ to go on dive trips to warm water destinations once or twice a year. That's the problem, get rid of them and the industry is fixed. Thanks for your insight.

The alternative to training divers poorly is not "getting rid of them", it is to train them well.

 

[1thumper]

There seems a fair amount of somewhat snotty disparagement of "vacation divers" here? The vacation divers have tremendous value for our community and should be encouraged, not looked down upon, or run through a grinder so that they are perfectly qualified to dive in any and all recreational diving scenarios. Some benefits that they have for the "serious" diving community:
- some of them will eventually become the "serious divers" that are necessary to keep our sport going for the next generation, as the current divers eventually will retire their fins
- the equipment that they buy, along with the equipment needed at the centers that train them, provides both economy of scale and a source of R&D funding for equipment manufacturers to steadily improve their products and help keep the unit cost down
- the many courses that they take provides a living for a lot of dive professionals, who otherwise maybe would have to do something else. Same thing with dive resorts, without this population many excellent destinations probably could not have been developed and thus never would have become accessible to our diving population. These "vacation divers" pay for a lot of the infrastructure that provides benefit to "serious divers".

A lot of it comes down to the instructor. The 4-day warm-water OW wonder can be congratulated for getting certified, but also should be carefully told by the instructor at that time the skills that they have learned have not prepared them to dive under all recreational conditions, and if they are going to dive in scenarios such as cold water with heavy currents they should get additional local training first, because those conditions just cannot be replicated at a tropical location. This should also help LDS because they are the ones who are best suited for such specialized local training. LDS can encourage this; if a diver that they don't know comes in for a fill they can determine in a friendly fashion what the diver's experience is and if it is inadequate to the local conditions they can recommend caution and maybe up-sell that tank fill into a refresher or specialty course.

The other is dive centers/boats. While I will perhaps grumble under my breath a bit when arriving at a new location and am asked to show a dive log and maybe do a check-out dive, it's a valid process. It isn't just about checking quality of training, such practices also help evaluate currency of skills....even a well-trained diver will be rusty is they haven't had a dive in a long time. If the person's skills/knowledge are in doubt, require that they do a refresher course or at a minimum go out with a DM who can help keep them (and the reefs) safe.

When skiing I don't mind sharing the mountain with the less experienced, even though though do occasionally clog things up. Same thing with the ocean, if someone only can dive once per year while on vacation, fine, I don't mind sharing the ocean with them so long as the vacation dive operator acts responsibly to keep things safe.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Maybe there needs to be a two tiered open water course, vacation and serious local.

There already is a two-tiered open water course ...

For the diver who wants quick and easy, there's Open Water ...

... and for the diver who wants even less, there's Scuba Diver ...

What more could anyone possibly want?

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

There seems a fair amount of somewhat snotty disparagement of "vacation divers" here? The vacation divers have tremendous value for our community and should be encouraged, not looked down upon, or run through a grinder so that they are perfectly qualified to dive in any and all recreational diving scenarios. Some benefits that they have for the "serious" diving community:
- some of them will eventually become the "serious divers" that are necessary to keep our sport going for the next generation, as the current divers eventually will retire their fins
- the equipment that they buy, along with the equipment needed at the centers that train them, provides both economy of scale and a source of R&D funding for equipment manufacturers to steadily improve their products and help keep the unit cost down
- the many courses that they take provides a living for a lot of dive professionals, who otherwise maybe would have to do something else. Same thing wth dive resorts, without this population many excellent destinations probably could not have been developed and thus never would have become accessible to our diving population. These "vacation divers" pay for a lot of the infrastructure that provides benefit to "serious divers".

I'm not sure anyone's disparaging vacation divers ... people dive for different reasons, and it's not uncommon for those of us teaching in cold water locales to train students who only intend to dive while on a tropical trip somewhere. There's nothing wrong with that motivation ... but it should not be used as an excuse to train them poorly, on the assumption that they won't need or use the skills that a well-taught class can provide them. I think it's the dumbed-down classes that are being disparaged ... not the students who take them.

A lot of it comes down to the instructor. The 4-day warm-water OW wonder can be congratulated for getting certified, but also should be carefully told by the instructor at that time the skills that they have learned have not prepared them to dive under all recreational conditions, and if they are going to dive in scenarios such as cold water with heavy currents they should get additional local training first, because those conditions just cannot be replicated at a tropical location. This should also help LDS because they are the ones who are best suited for such specialized local training. LDS can encourage this; if a diver that they don't know comes in for a fill they can determine in a friendly fashion what the diver's experience is and if it is inadequate to the local conditions they can recommend caution and maybe up-sell that tank fill into a refresher or specialty course.

This can only work if the dive ops and dive centers involved truly care about the well-being of their customers, rather than making the priority making as much money for as little effort as possible ... and unfortunately, the latter is exactly how I read the OP in this thread.

The other is dive centers/boats. While I will perhaps grumble under my breath a bit when arriving at a new location and am asked to show a dive log and maybe do a check-out dive, it's a valid process. It isn't just about checking quality of training, such practices also help evaluate currency of skills....even a well-trained diver will be rusty is they haven't had a dive in a long time. If the person's skills/knowledge are in doubt, require that they do a refresher course or at a minimum go out with a DM who can help keep them (and the reefs) safe.

If only it were so. Most checkout dives are a joke that typically consist of a DM wanting to see you clear your mask and recover a reg while parked on your knees. I once had a DM ask me to do it over because I hovered rather than kneeled down ... and he wanted to "make sure I was properly weighted". How pathetic is that, really? The sad thing is that ... despite the fact that this guy dived every day ... I don't think he actually knew any better ...

When skiing I don't mind sharing the mountain with the less experienced, even though though do occassionally clog things up. Same thing with the ocean, if someone only can dive once per year while on vacation, fine, I don't mind sharing the ocean with them so long as the vacation dive operator acts responsibly to keep things safe.

My biggest issue with this is that dive operators typically create their policies based on a "lowest common denominator" theory wherein every diver gets treated like they just completed the one-day class the OP is describing. Those of us who don't need or want a nanny get one anyway ... because with so many poorly-trained "divers" out there, the dive op needs to protect themselves from potential liability issues.

That said, I don't blame divers for their poor training and skills ... I blame the instructors who gave them a card without making them earn it ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Thalassamania]

Thanks, now I know how to make the scuba industry better.

Get rid of all those damned vacation divers, you know the ones that spend their vacation and their $$$ to go on dive trips to warm water destinations once or twice a year. That's the problem, get rid of them and the industry is fixed. Thanks for your insight.

There is a middle ground, a bunny slope if you will, develop a system that helps vacation divers to enjoy themselves underwater always with the assistance of leadership personnel.