Making Steel Doubles as Buoyant as Possible

[Caveeagle]

Just thinking a little “outside the box”...

Dive Rite makes a 10# trim pillow. I just recently saw one for sale used attached to a tech buttplate. I have not personally tried this with a set of dubs... but I do have a variant of this design on my O2ptima CCR wing. This one does not have the corrugated inflator hose, but a dry suit style inflator down near the normal left dump.

Now, it might take some practice to quickly get to the b/u inflator, but that’s pretty much the case with any dual bladder wing too.

And in a pinch, I bet 10# of lift would be enough to allow you to swim up the rig.. and this small bladder will burp off the excess as it expands.. so you might get the added safety of not rocketing topside faster than you really want to.

 

[Caveeagle]

Dive Rite Trim Inflation Pillow Wing And Buttplate For Sidemount Diving | eBay

This is the ad I was referring to. I will say this rigging looms pretty shotty.. but that’s not to say it could not be refined to add the 10# emergency lift at the bottom of your backplate.

Back in the day, I had seen cave divers layer two wings for redundancy.

 

[ajduplessis]

Add a second wing, not a dual bladder. Or get a drysuit with a relief valve.

 

[swimlikethefish]

I looked for a "hahaha" emoji after this, assuming it's a joke. If not, it's possibly the dumbest thing I've read on SB in a while. Drain your tanks in an emergency?

There is another post by the OP regarding using SMB's as lift devices. Everything under the sun has been explained. From diving a balanced rig to dual bladder wings and drysuits to lift bags and using aluminum tanks.

At this point it seems we are being trolled. He ended the last posts in the other thread with saying he was getting a drysuit. Then started this one looking for other ideas without a drysuit.

When I feel I am being asked stupid questions I give sarcastic stupid answers. I in no way recommend free-flowing regs at depth. Ymmv.

 

[Ryan Mcshane]

Ah but then I have to solve the pee problem.

Pee valves are a wonderful thing. You just plug your dinkle into the dongle and you’re good to go!

 

[Graeme Fraser]

There is another post by the OP regarding using SMB's as lift devices. Everything under the sun has been explained. From diving a balanced rig to dual bladder wings and drysuits to lift bags and using aluminum tanks.

At this point it seems we are being trolled. He ended the last posts in the other thread with saying he was getting a drysuit. Then started this one looking for other ideas without a drysuit.

When I feel I am being asked stupid questions I give sarcastic stupid answers. I in no way recommend free-flowing regs at depth. Ymmv.

Yep, I'm with you on that.

 

[CT-Rich]

Double 85's are -13.4lbs full and 0 when empty. Just free flow your regs and empty the tanks (not fully as you still need to breath). You will gain close to 13.4 lbs of lift.

Or, get a lift bag and climb your way to the surface. Better start practicing that now if you plan on taking any tech courses. Every course I've done required a lift bag ascent.

Why do people keep posting this a viable solution? If you are stuck on the bottom, why would you waste time and more importantly life giving gas? The basic question is what needs to be done to create redundant buoyancy? Breathing gas is not and never should be an option. You get in the water with a contingency plan to get out.

With a wetsuit, that is primary buoyancy is a BCD, secondary is ditchable lead. With steel doubles you need another option because at depth you will not have enough lift from a compressed suit.

The next option would be to upgrade to a Drysuit, they are better suited for diving at depth because they won’t lose insulating ability at depth. They also act as a redundant form of buoyancy in the event of a BCD failure. An intro Drysuit can be had for under $1,000, which isn’t cheap, but if want to dive doubles, you are going to spend money, and not just for the tanks. Sometimes doing it right and safe will cost money.

Another option is to use a BCD that has multiple bladders. This seems pretty reasonable to me also, costs money.

The least expensive solution would be to use AL tank with a lightweight back plate. I am not sure if this would be completely swimable from the bottom full, but the OP was talking about using steel 85s. Just using the lighter tanks will give a huge head start on fixing it.

I would recommend taking a tech course and learn to do these dives properly.

Don’t sit on the bottom bleeding down your tanks.

 

[CT-Rich]

There is another post by the OP regarding using SMB's as lift devices. Everything under the sun has been explained. From diving a balanced rig to dual bladder wings and drysuits to lift bags and using aluminum tanks.

At this point it seems we are being trolled. He ended the last posts in the other thread with saying he was getting a drysuit. Then started this one looking for other ideas without a drysuit.

When I feel I am being asked stupid questions I give sarcastic stupid answers. I in no way recommend free-flowing regs at depth. Ymmv.

About once a year someone seriously suggests something like this. The whole balanced rig argument was based on solutions other than ditchable weight. I stopped assuming this type of advice in a basic forum was a joke.

 

[Compressor]

Why do people keep posting this a viable solution? If you are stuck on the bottom, why would you waste time and more importantly life giving gas? The basic question is what needs to be done to create redundant buoyancy? Breathing gas is not and never should be an option. You get in the water with a contingency plan to get out.

With a wetsuit, that is primary buoyancy is a BCD, secondary is ditchable lead. With steel doubles you need another option because at depth you will not have enough lift from a compressed suit.

The next option would be to upgrade to a Drysuit, they are better suited for diving at depth because they won’t lose insulating ability at depth. They also act as a redundant form of buoyancy in the event of a BCD failure. An intro Drysuit can be had for under $1,000, which isn’t cheap, but if want to dive doubles, you are going to spend money, and not just for the tanks. Sometimes doing it right and safe will cost money.

Another option is to use a BCD that has multiple bladders. This seems pretty reasonable to me also, costs money.

The least expensive solution would be to use AL tank with a lightweight back plate. I am not sure if this would be completely swimable from the bottom full, but the OP was talking about using steel 85s. Just using the lighter tanks will give a huge head start on fixing it.

I would recommend taking a tech course and learn to do these dives properly.

Don’t sit on the bottom bleeding down your tanks.

Exactly. You need the right tool for the right job.

 

[swimlikethefish]

About once a year someone seriously suggests something like this. The whole balanced rig argument was based on solutions other than ditchable weight. I stopped assuming this type of advice in a basic forum was a joke.

I let my attitude get the best of me earlier when posting this. I also failed to realize the broad audience, it being in the basic scuba forum. I am sorry for being brash. I was merely attempting to get the op's attention, so he might understand what others were attempting to state over 2 seperate threads. When he didn't receive the answer he wanted he started the second.

With that said: here is the link to the other thread for you to understand where the op is coming from.
SMB as backup lift source.

I 100% agree with your sentiment that the op should seek, qualified training from and educated instructor in his area. I should have had better etiquette and for that, I am sorry for my ignorant comments that I shouldn't have wrote.

Between this thread and the one linked I believe we have covered just about every opportunity to learn about proper redundancy when diving doubles. And the ways in which you would apply those principles.

Be safe, happy diving.