The problem isn't just with caves it is also wrecks, deep, cold, current. lines, lift bags and bunches of other stuff. The number one killer of divers is diving beyond their training and experience. I see it every weekend. Most get lucky and live but IMO evolution has betrayed us. Divers are encouraged to go too far too fast by their freinds (always super experienced know-it-alls who should keep their BS to themselves), new buudies on boats and idiot little DM's at resorts. After all this urging which is contrary to their training they think their instructor is wrong and was just trying to sell them classes. Of all the hundreds of divers who have died in caves only a few were trained to be there. Of all the hundreds of divers who have died anywhere only a few were trained to do what they were doing. If divers don't wake up we will see more government intervention. With all the crap I see and hear I'm getting skiddish about giving anyone a card.
Lost Diver Found In Cave
- Thread starter Mr Crab
- Start date
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greyface
Guest
Hey James - That looks like the sign in Devil's Eye. That thing puts a bulge in the back of my wetsuit. :holycow: Me, in a cave? No way, Jose! :reaper:
Zept
Contributor
For me, the sign James posted doesn't really work. It says, 'Go away, caves are dangerous,' but it doesn't say why.
I wouldn't go into a cave, because 1) caves are nasty dark holes full of water, you've got to be joking and 2) I've been reading this board for a while, and I know better. For example, I know it's really easy to silt up a cave, and I've done enough low-vis dives to know how disorienting that is. However, I can imagine divers seeing the 'danger of death' sign, venturing past it anyway, having no immediate problems, figuring the dangers were exaggerated, and carrying on... and then Darwin gets his dues.
Would it be very difficult to make a sign that tells people why cave diving is dangerous?
Zept
I wouldn't go into a cave, because 1) caves are nasty dark holes full of water, you've got to be joking and 2) I've been reading this board for a while, and I know better. For example, I know it's really easy to silt up a cave, and I've done enough low-vis dives to know how disorienting that is. However, I can imagine divers seeing the 'danger of death' sign, venturing past it anyway, having no immediate problems, figuring the dangers were exaggerated, and carrying on... and then Darwin gets his dues.
Would it be very difficult to make a sign that tells people why cave diving is dangerous?
Zept
Iguana Don
Guest
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"For me, the sign James posted doesn't really work. It says, 'Go away, caves are dangerous,' but it doesn't say why."
The sign says,
"Without cave training and cave equipment, divers can die.
It can happen to you."
That's pretty plain to me.
ID
The sign says,
"Without cave training and cave equipment, divers can die.
It can happen to you."
That's pretty plain to me.
ID
Zept
Contributor
And people die in road accidents every year. Doesn't stop people from driving. Doesn't stop people from driving like lunatics, either.
If someone tells me something is dangerous, I want to know why. That's my nature. I'm a cautious person, so I'll ask why or do some reading or whatever. Other people are more inclined to go past the sign and wait for the lightning bolt to hit.
'Danger of death' is pretty vague. People die in open water, and even in swimming pools, so all diving involves risks. It's knowing what's required to dive caves safely, and knowing that I don't have the skills or equipment, that enables me to assess the risks and stay well away. Works for me, anyway.
Zept
If someone tells me something is dangerous, I want to know why. That's my nature. I'm a cautious person, so I'll ask why or do some reading or whatever. Other people are more inclined to go past the sign and wait for the lightning bolt to hit.
'Danger of death' is pretty vague. People die in open water, and even in swimming pools, so all diving involves risks. It's knowing what's required to dive caves safely, and knowing that I don't have the skills or equipment, that enables me to assess the risks and stay well away. Works for me, anyway.
Zept
Kaffphine
Guest
Mr Crab-
Thanks for the article, it's always good to know what the disuccions about.
Thanks for the article, it's always good to know what the disuccions about.
JamesK
Contributor
Zept,
If the sign explained everyway that a diver can die in a cave, then the sign would block the entrance to the cave. Besides, no one would actually sit their long enough to read it. Even if the sign was more detailed, the people who are stupid enough to pass the current sign, would pass any sign. If it said, "caves are very easy to silt out", then people would just go "Wel the I will make sure I don't silt it out!".
Greyface, that sign is not only in ginnie, but in almost every cave system in Florida.
If the sign explained everyway that a diver can die in a cave, then the sign would block the entrance to the cave. Besides, no one would actually sit their long enough to read it. Even if the sign was more detailed, the people who are stupid enough to pass the current sign, would pass any sign. If it said, "caves are very easy to silt out", then people would just go "Wel the I will make sure I don't silt it out!".
Greyface, that sign is not only in ginnie, but in almost every cave system in Florida.
Zept
Contributor
Fair point, I guess it's a bit late for remedial education at that point. But when do divers get that education? During my OW course, we were told that 'overhead environments are dangerous'. That was pretty much it. It's only now that I have some small understanding of the risks involved that I find myself thinking, 'Boy, overhead environments REALLY ARE dangerous'.
Zept
tombiowami
Contributor
But we don't describe every way that some one can die from high speed, or taking a curve to sharp, or driving on a slippery road...
Some folks are just plain dumb. I think it was Jesse V. that said you cannot legislate away stupidity.
Tommy
landlocked
Contributor
How does that go......? "Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups!"
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