Lion fish hunting

[TMHeimer]

But hugging trees isn't nearly as tasty. . .

I'm no expert re divers harming the environment vs. lionfish doing so. I THINK I agree with you regarding the diver vs. lionfish "inner caveman" thing in the name of conservation. PADI says "take only pics., leave only bubbles and now, move only yourself". That doesn't apply to lionfish, I guess (since man apparently brought them to the Western Hemisphere). I guess it only applies to all life NEVER touched/affected by man.... hmmm. So go ahead all you lion hunters--kill them all, while I commit an atrocity by collecting live shells that are not even endangered--so I can be tarred and feathered.

Sorry, I clicked the wrong post- my reply was to Rhone Man.

 

[Scuba_Jenny]

If a multi-prong spear tip is used, and multiple prongs are delivered to the head or gill plate region, the fish will, to a large extent, be immobilized .

This should eliminate the need to actually grab the fish with your hands when placing it in a bag, clipping spines or removing the fish from the spear. Avoiding the temptation for direct contact with the fish is one of the benefits of a "paralyzer" tip over a single prong device which may allow the fish to move or spin, sometimes at the worst time.

Agree. However in the event you need to handle the fish..

I have a paralyzer tip on my LF spear, and using the Zookeeper eliminates the need to remove spines at depth. Before I got the Zookeeper, I had to remove the spines as the boat I was diving on had a strict "no spines on boat" policy.

Not wanting to hijack the thread, but I have long believed that Lionfish hunting in the name of conservation is just a cover for all these conservation indoctrinated instructors to release their inner cave man.

I was recently in Cayman, and when we dived the rarely dived sites they were teeming with Lionfish, but the reefs were also vibrant and full of marine life. When we dived the more popular sites the instructors had hunted the Lionfish to extinction, but the coral was generally pretty trampled and marine life scarce.

From this I concluded that divers are far more harmful to the marine environment than Lionfish. I have no problem with people hunting Lionfish, but the faux conservationism is starting to wear on me.

Perhaps then you should dive in an area that has been decimated by lionfish for a different perspective?
I did a lionfish rodeo last summer. Our team only got 45 lionfish. That's a substantial number. And all those fish need to eat. What do you think they are eating? In their native habitat, they get to about 8", at least half of what we got were over 10", with two of them in the 15" range. And it's only been a few years that this invasion has really come to light. I saw my first LF 3 years ago.

 

[victorzamora]

My take on humans vs lionfish (not that it matters) is that, yes, humans DO damage the reef......but so do Lionfish. Divers are going to be there anyway, they had might as well remove one source of reef destruction while they're there GIVEN they do it in a responsible way.

As for hunting them, ask a DM/Guide if they're hunting Lionfish and ask to watch them. Watch for a dive or two, until you get the hang of it, and then slaughter away.

 

[Scuba_Jenny]

Not wanting to hijack the thread, but I have long believed that Lionfish hunting in the name of conservation is just a cover for all these conservation indoctrinated instructors to release their inner cave man.

So.. you think that instructors have this need to kill, and lionfish are an easy target? What about all the spearfishermen who have been hunting for years, they are not abandoning other species in favor of lionfish.

I was recently in Cayman, and when we dived the rarely dived sites they were teeming with Lionfish, but the reefs were also vibrant and full of marine life. When we dived the more popular sites the instructors had hunted the Lionfish to extinction, but the coral was generally pretty trampled and marine life scarce.

So, you did a dive on a reef with lionfish and assumed the reef was healthy. What did the reef look like 10 years ago? Maybe what you saw is the beginning of the decimation, not the end.
Then you assume that just because a popular site with trampled coral and scarce marine life; you didn't think that is the impact of overuse? I can take you to quite a few sites in the Florida keys where the area has been loved to smitherens by divers. And take you to a pristine location teeming with lionfish. There is more to the environmental impact than just lionfish or what you see on a dive vacation. Our reefs are being attacked by pollution, over use, carelessness, and a bunch of environmental factors. And you decide that a dive on a reef is justification to whether or not lionfish is a problem?

From this I concluded that divers are far more harmful to the marine environment than Lionfish. I have no problem with people hunting Lionfish, but the faux conservationism is starting to wear on me.

Perhaps both are harmful and we need to do something about both?

 

[maniago]

Will soon be on a dive trip to the Cancun area. The dive guide I've selected mentioned that on one of his dive excursions they're is a Lion Fish invasion and that spear hunting is 'encouraged'.

I've got no experience Lion Fish hunting, but it sounds super intriguing. From what I'm reading, it's generally a safe activity. Has anyone here been Lion Fish hunting? Care to share your stories and experiences? I'm still on the fence as to whether or not we take him up on the offer.

Thanks!

Back to the OPs question.

Much is blown up about spearing these things. They are easy to catch and even easier to deal with in the water. I'm just back from a Bahamas lionfish eradication trip. A few pics at https://www.facebook.com/atlanticedge We bagged 81 (and ate them, yum yum, esp cervechi), and killed over a 100 total. They are cake to spear and I'm a novice - these are the first fish I've ever speared. Def use a long paralizer 3prong tip, and preferable if the tines are pretty close together. I used a wide/short 3 pronger and I hit plenty but lost about 50% off the tines. I used a 6' fold spear, but any shorty 4'er is fine. They just don't move until you are about 3-4" from them. Can't be any easier spearing practice. Also, we found that its much easier once on the tines to grab them by the face with your "gloved" hand and slide them off the tines. Either stuff them in the bag tail first or cut the spines off and use a stringer. Either way is easier than maneuvering them on the spear into the bag. They can't sting you if you have them by the face, and they actually have a rough mustache patch around the outside of their mouths that acts like "worn out" velcro to your glove fingers. And once grabbed they are mesmerized - don't move at all, even when then trimming their spines. I had all sorts of gloves, even puncture proof ones. Chuck them all out and go get a set of mechanics gloves from Lowes. They are thin leather, worked marvelous and pretty much everyone went with them after a bit. We had 13 divers do 14 dives in 3 days. Was a glorious trip and I'm still on the vacation high from it. Cant wait to do it again.

 

[Scuba_Jenny]

Really? Mechanics gloves? No worry about being punctured? Will have to look into them I have the needle proof ones, but they are so bullky, I never wear them

 

[maniago]

Yup Mechanics gloves, not kidding. Their spines can't bend over their bodies forward and poke you if you have them by the snout - they point backwards. For sure if you grab them by the tail, you're a hurtin' camper. Even the sharks that bothered us a few times would come up to the spear and bite them off head first - never tail first. Sharks aren't stupid...

You could spear them with no gloves, but their mustache is a bit spikey for my liking - like that stiff grass they have on florida lawns....

 

[Scuba_Jenny]

Lol, I don't wear gloves spearing..

Sent from my LG-MS770 using Tapatalk 4

 

[Rhone Man]

So.. you think that instructors have this need to kill, and lionfish are an easy target? What about all the spearfishermen who have been hunting for years, they are not abandoning other species in favor of lionfish.

So, you did a dive on a reef with lionfish and assumed the reef was healthy. What did the reef look like 10 years ago? Maybe what you saw is the beginning of the decimation, not the end.
Then you assume that just because a popular site with trampled coral and scarce marine life; you didn't think that is the impact of overuse? I can take you to quite a few sites in the Florida keys where the area has been loved to smitherens by divers. And take you to a pristine location teeming with lionfish. There is more to the environmental impact than just lionfish or what you see on a dive vacation. Our reefs are being attacked by pollution, over use, carelessness, and a bunch of environmental factors. And you decide that a dive on a reef is justification to whether or not lionfish is a problem?

Perhaps both are harmful and we need to do something about both?

There is zero chance that all the instructors in the world shooting lion fish full time could turn back the tide. Equally it is a biological certainty that at some point lion fish will reach equilibrium with their new environment (unless for some freakish reason they behave as no invasive species has behaved before - which no one is suggesting).

Hence if you have people beavering away doing something that makes no damn difference at all, you can only conclude that they must be doing it because they enjoy it.

For me, hearing the arguments in favour of lion fish hunting are about as credible as the arguments in favour of fox hunting (pest control) in the UK in the 1990s.

YMMV.

 

[TMHeimer]

There is zero chance that all the instructors in the world shooting lion fish full time could turn back the tide. Equally it is a biological certainty that at some point lion fish will reach equilibrium with their new environment (unless for some freakish reason they behave as no invasive species has behaved before - which no one is suggesting).

Hence if you have people beavering away doing something that makes no damn difference at all, you can only conclude that they must be doing it because they enjoy it.

For me, hearing the arguments in favour of lion fish hunting are about as credible as the arguments in favour of fox hunting (pest control) in the UK in the 1990s.

YMMV.

Once again I agree. I have heard that the numbers of lionfish below rec. depth limits are so high that divers killing any of them makes little or no difference in the overall picture-- not that I have any issues with them doing so.