LE Proton Metal Reg doesn't breath well

[blawler1]

Mares LE Proton Problems- Help Mare Techs

(I also posted this in the regulator forum)

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I purchased a couple of the Mares limited edition proton metal regs last year for my wife and myself. While my wife hasn't complained about the breathing on hers, other than a whistling sound on inhale, I have not been pleased with the performance of mine since I got it. On the first dives I made a couple of weeks after I got it, after 70ft. down, I was having to work to get a breath. It whistled and made clicks when I had to breath deeply. Later on more shallow shore dives it seemed to loosen up a bit and breath OK.

I called the dealer (Divers Supply) when I got back and they said that the HP seat was probably tight and needed to be broken in with more dives. In addition, I took it to a dive shop tech who checked the IP and said it was within range. Well, approximately 40 dives and 18 months later it, still does not perform satisfactorily. Recently I had to switch to my back up regulator, a Sporasub Alto + (Mares MR12) because I couldn't get enough air from the LE for bug hunting at 80 ft.

I suspect there is something wrong with the first stage as the proton metal is a fairly widely used 2nd while this first stage is unique to this regulator of which only 2000 (I have #906, my wife #115) were manufactured. The first stage of this regulator is quite small and looks much like the MR 42, although it is supposed to be even lighter. One unique feature of this first stage is that the DFC feature is built into all LP ports, as opposed to just one as on every other Mares model. This makes me wonder if some of the effectiveness of the DFC system in reducing pressure drop on inhalation has been lost as all ports can use this? Just a thought.

Please if there are any Mares techs, dealers, representatives, or others having experience with this reg, please let me know. I know that the reg is about ready for servicing, so I am willing to send it to a certified Mares repair center for the annual as well as any additional repairs within reason to make it perform at a level it was designed to, otherwise there may be a Z2 Atomic in my near future

 

[Greg Barlow]

Mares LE Proton Problems- Help Mare Techs

(I also posted this in the regulator forum)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I purchased a couple of the Mares limited edition proton metal regs last year for my wife and myself. While my wife hasn't complained about the breathing on hers, other than a whistling sound on inhale, I have not been pleased with the performance of mine since I got it. On the first dives I made a couple of weeks after I got it, after 70ft. down, I was having to work to get a breath. It whistled and made clicks when I had to breath deeply. Later on more shallow shore dives it seemed to loosen up a bit and breath OK.

I called the dealer (Divers Supply) when I got back and they said that the HP seat was probably tight and needed to be broken in with more dives. In addition, I took it to a dive shop tech who checked the IP and said it was within range. Well, approximately 40 dives and 18 months later it, still does not perform satisfactorily. Recently I had to switch to my back up regulator, a Sporasub Alto + (Mares MR12) because I couldn't get enough air from the LE for bug hunting at 80 ft.

I suspect there is something wrong with the first stage as the proton metal is a fairly widely used 2nd while this first stage is unique to this regulator of which only 2000 (I have #906, my wife #115) were manufactured. The first stage of this regulator is quite small and looks much like the MR 42, although it is supposed to be even lighter. One unique feature of this first stage is that the DFC feature is built into all LP ports, as opposed to just one as on every other Mares model. This makes me wonder if some of the effectiveness of the DFC system in reducing pressure drop on inhalation has been lost as all ports can use this? Just a thought.

Please if there are any Mares techs, dealers, representatives, or others having experience with this reg, please let me know. I know that the reg is about ready for servicing, so I am willing to send it to a certified Mares repair center for the annual as well as any additional repairs within reason to make it perform at a level it was designed to, otherwise there may be a Z2 Atomic in my near future

I own a Mares V42 Proton Metal, which is actually mechanically the same reg. I also service Mares products, and can tell you that your reg is not functioning normally. My own personal reg has been on several deep dives, and on ice dives. I could not be happier with it.

The V42 uses the SCS (spherical core seal) system as does your LE model. The new MR42 uses the tri-material valve assembly, and the two are not interchangeable in those models. However, Mares has plenty of rebuild kits for the LE, as it uses all the same components as the V42.

My suggestion would be to have the Mares headquarters actually service it. If you don't want to go that route, then I can highly recommend Scuba Toys in Texas. Larry is a regular poster on this site, and is highly reputable.

Greg Barlow
Former Science Editor for Rodale's Scuba Diving Magazine

 

[blawler1]

Greg,

Thanks for information. I had been thinking about Scubatoys since they are in Dallas and I'm in Austin. It's been surprisingly tough to find folks to work on Mares regulators here in Austin since the shop where I got my regs changed hands and the owner and his wife, who were their Mares tech, left the state. I have in the past had mixed success getting Mares America to look at my stuff. They have been very helpful in the past especially on the Sporasub stuff, because the locals weren't familar and especially on warranty work. Having used the Sporasub equivalent of the MR 12 and V 16 with great satisfaction, I just couldn't believe that this is as good as it gets for this top end reg. My problem has been that we have been doing so much easy diving in Bonaire lately that it took this recent trip to push me to do something about it.

I would be open to any Mares reps dropping me a line to walk me through either channeling the reg through a local shop like Scubaland to Mares America or if you would take it directly. Frankly I do not think having Divers Supply work on it because I have had regs come back with the primary not on the DFC port, which gives me pause as to their attention to detail. Please left me if you are making a tri-material up grade kits for these limited edition regulators and not just leaving them to a Dracor fate.

Being equipped with Sporasub or Mares from head to foot with the exception of my Bio fins (sorry I tried the Raptors, but didn't like them so I gave them to my wife along with her volos)

 

[Greg Barlow]

I would be open to any Mares reps dropping me a line to walk me through either channeling the reg through a local shop like Scubaland to Mares America or if you would take it directly. Frankly I do not think having Divers Supply work on it because I have had regs come back with the primary not on the DFC port, which gives me pause as to their attention to detail. Please left me if you are making a tri-material up grade kits for these limited edition regulators and not just leaving them to a Dracor fate.

The tri-material upgrade is not likely to happen, as the SCS system used on your reg and my own V42, is very dependable and long lasting. The soft seat compound holds up well to long term use, as well as high cylinder pressures.

Mares decided to use tri-material valves in all of their diaphragm regs. This was a good move as the HP valves used in regs such as the MR12 and MR22 was not very dependable. The SCS system was considerably better, and the last versions especially so.

The LE and 42 series first stages are rather small, and the standard sized HP valve components are too physically large to fit the unit. That is why the parts are specific to those regs.

Let me know how it works out. Again, ScubaToys is an outstanding dealer.

Greg

 

[Phil Mintz]

Greg,

Thanks for information. I had been thinking about Scubatoys since they are in Dallas and I'm in Austin. It's been surprisingly tough to find folks to work on Mares regulators here in Austin since the shop where I got my regs changed hands and the owner and his wife, who were their Mares tech, left the state. I have in the past had mixed success getting Mares America to look at my stuff. They have been very helpful in the past especially on the Sporasub stuff, because the locals weren't familar and especially on warranty work. Having used the Sporasub equivalent of the MR 12 and V 16 with great satisfaction, I just couldn't believe that this is as good as it gets for this top end reg. My problem has been that we have been doing so much easy diving in Bonaire lately that it took this recent trip to push me to do something about it.

I would be open to any Mares reps dropping me a line to walk me through either channeling the reg through a local shop like Scubaland to Mares America or if you would take it directly. Frankly I do not think having Divers Supply work on it because I have had regs come back with the primary not on the DFC port, which gives me pause as to their attention to detail. Please left me if you are making a tri-material up grade kits for these limited edition regulators and not just leaving them to a Dracor fate.

Being equipped with Sporasub or Mares from head to foot with the exception of my Bio fins (sorry I tried the Raptors, but didn't like them so I gave them to my wife along with her volos)

Hi,

Send me a PM with your e-mail address, I will have our CS department contact you and set up a service call in our center.

No problems,

Phil

 

[blawler1]

I just want to give a shout out to Phil Mintz and the HEAD/Mares folks for stepping in and helping me with this problem. Mares rebuilt the regulator on their nickel. Thats a class organization. With the money I saved from not going out and buying an Atomic Z2, I can get a Nemo to replace my old Surveyor Nitrox.

I am counting the days until I get to take it out to try it out, but I know it has to be much improved after they rebuilt and bench tested it. We were trying to make our first trip to Curacao for Christmas but reduced American schedules are making this difficult. Hopefully we will be in one of the ABCs before long.

As a follow up so I am fully informed for future service on this reg, in researching this board after making my original post, I noticed a post a couple of years ago where a gentleman reported a similar problem to mine and Zak Ohara commented that there is a screw that adjusts the DFC on thE LE first stage. I was wondering if that is unique to the LE or if this is shared with the 42? My understanding is that the LE first stage is the only one with DFC on all ports and so it seems logical that this would be unique. Can anyone help me with this one?

 

[Zak OHara]

blawer,

We are glad you feel you received good customer service. This is something we spend alot of time trying to accomplish.

The LE regulator is the only regulator in our product line to offer DFC on all LP ports. This is not an end user adjustment, but one for a service tech to fine tune the DFC to function at it's best capacity. Once it is set, it should not be adjusted until next service. I am sure our service department has it set at the appropriate position for optimum performance.

Have a great trip to Curacao, I'm jealous.

Best regards,

 

[blawler1]

I assure you and the other nice folks at Mares that I have no intention of going in and tinkering with any adjustments as I am certain the Mares techs did it right. My main purpose was try to obtain useful information regarding the unique aspects of these regulators (we have two) that, as these will probably be the last regs we get, I could make sure that for future services that I will have to rely on the local shop or Scuba Toys, that their technicians are aware of the important differences from the V42. I know it may sound picky, but I have received my Sporasub regulators back from servicing from both the dealer (where I purchased my LE reg and who had supposedly serviced it before I bought it) and a local shop with the primary mounted on a non-DFC port even though I sent them in on the right port. So my experiences with regulator servicing has made me wary. The Mares techs didn't provide any feedback other than list the items serviced, but if I were a betting man, I would bet that the dealer tech cranked this screw down too tight when they serviced it.

 

[Zak OHara]

I assure you and the other nice folks at Mares that I have no intention of going in and tinkering with any adjustments as I am certain the Mares techs did it right. My main purpose was try to obtain useful information regarding the unique aspects of these regulators (we have two) that, as these will probably be the last regs we get, I could make sure that for future services that I will have to rely on the local shop or Scuba Toys, that their technicians are aware of the important differences from the V42. I know it may sound picky, but I have received my Sporasub regulators back from servicing from both the dealer (where I purchased my LE reg and who had supposedly serviced it before I bought it) and a local shop with the primary mounted on a non-DFC port even though I sent them in on the right port. So my experiences with regulator servicing has made me wary. The Mares techs didn't provide any feedback other than list the items serviced, but if I were a betting man, I would bet that the dealer tech cranked this screw down too tight when they serviced it.

No problem. I didn't assume you were going to work the adjustment yourself. I was just trying to explain it, as some have construed it as a user adjustable feature. Any service center that has gone through our extensive 3 day Mares Lab program, and passed successfully will know how to adjust the reg.

Our inhouse techs are generally very busy and most often will not make any comments about the service of product unless there is an issue.

Again have a great trip over the holidays.

Best regards,