vshearer
Contributor
Yep, and I just went to my local Hazmat DOT hydro (a fire equipment supplier) since it was half what the shop wanted and much closer.
EDIT: ..and while I think I trust my LDS, there is a conflict of interest when they hydro.
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Yep, and I just went to my local Hazmat DOT hydro (a fire equipment supplier) since it was half what the shop wanted and much closer.
EDIT: ..and while I think I trust my LDS, there is a conflict of interest when they hydro.
Papa_Bear
Contributor
Maybe we can get them to do it for free! Or maybe the Government can pay for as it should be a right to have a hydro!???? All business charge service fees even if its not preformed in house! It amazes me how people want the dive industry or LDS store to give their services away? So dive them all out of business and get good service over the internet! I will continue to support my local Dive shop! There should be more to a dive shop than hydros!
You're right. The shop owners aren't getting rich. I know, I owned one.
What they do, however, is let the manufacturers and the agencies tell how they are going to run their businesses. It really does put severe limits on what a shop owner can do to improve his business...can't sell online to increase the size of your market...price controles, can't service brands you don't sell, minimum volume requirements, stocking requirements, sales reps strong-arming shops not to carry this brand or that and the list goes on.
The shop owners, in turn, pass all that BS on to the consumer by refusing to sell parts, charging high prices for equipment while they give away loss leader lousy training and so on.
It's like some kind of crazy pyrimid scheme where nobody gets anything excep the manufacturer and the agency...the shop owner and instructors get the privilage of "living the life style" LOL buy yourself a new car or a house with that why don't you.
ZzzKing
Contributor
Wet wetsuits are much sexier.
Wet drysuit?
That cancels itself out. Come to think of it, a suit that cancels itself out may make for an interesting contest. 
ArcticDiver
Contributor
Lest we become too embroiled in the negativity that goes with this repetitive topic it should be said that there are customer oriented dive shops. These shops are not always the cheapest, but they give value for the extra dollars.
By and large these shops are owned by folks who are first and foremost business people who got into diving. They do not espouse any particular philosophy of diving other than insisting that their staff and customers adhere to universally recognized safe diving practices when involved in an activity that affects their liability insurance. They consider every customer who walks into the store just as valiuable as any other customer. They do not "punish" customers for not buying equipment from them. Instead they welcome them and try their best to prove that they can compete with anyone. In short they are a business; not a hobby.
These stores are out there. They deserve to get their share of mine and everyone else's money.
By and large these shops are owned by folks who are first and foremost business people who got into diving. They do not espouse any particular philosophy of diving other than insisting that their staff and customers adhere to universally recognized safe diving practices when involved in an activity that affects their liability insurance. They consider every customer who walks into the store just as valiuable as any other customer. They do not "punish" customers for not buying equipment from them. Instead they welcome them and try their best to prove that they can compete with anyone. In short they are a business; not a hobby.
These stores are out there. They deserve to get their share of mine and everyone else's money.
There is nothing wrong with a shop charging for sending your tank out. I think the point is that we don't need a dive shop for that.
I don't want the dive shops to do anything for free. In fact, the first thing they should start charging real money for is training...but then they have to start teaching real classes.
Whether they do or not, I am NOT going to subsidize that training by paying high prices for equipment.
Pearldiver07
Contributor
Having managed a dive shop for awhile, I have to agree with MikeFerrera.
The equipment manufacturers dictate terms of sale, etc., while the training agencies do the same for certifications.
If LDS's are relegated to training and fills (and let's not forget servicing gear), get ready for a real downswing in the ability for divers to get certified. Think about it-how much do you think anyone would have to charge to keep a shop going on this? Let's face it, unless we all want to go back to a "Ma-&-Pa" arrangement working out people's garages, then the system of equipment and stores will have to change.
The brick and mortar stores will have to change to compete with on-line sales, but does anyone here remember the same crisis mentality with catalog sales of equipment? The doomsayers cried that the retail sky was falling then too. What this all means is that shop owners with no business skills will be filtered out - law of the economic jungle. Those that have enough business savvy to stay afloat will, even competing with the on line places.
As with everything, there will be a new balance. Some shops will go, some on line providers will go. Some goods/services will become primarily on line, others will tend toward the shops.
And I now dismount the ol' soap box for some else to have their turn...
The equipment manufacturers dictate terms of sale, etc., while the training agencies do the same for certifications.
If LDS's are relegated to training and fills (and let's not forget servicing gear), get ready for a real downswing in the ability for divers to get certified. Think about it-how much do you think anyone would have to charge to keep a shop going on this? Let's face it, unless we all want to go back to a "Ma-&-Pa" arrangement working out people's garages, then the system of equipment and stores will have to change.
The brick and mortar stores will have to change to compete with on-line sales, but does anyone here remember the same crisis mentality with catalog sales of equipment? The doomsayers cried that the retail sky was falling then too. What this all means is that shop owners with no business skills will be filtered out - law of the economic jungle. Those that have enough business savvy to stay afloat will, even competing with the on line places.
As with everything, there will be a new balance. Some shops will go, some on line providers will go. Some goods/services will become primarily on line, others will tend toward the shops.
And I now dismount the ol' soap box for some else to have their turn...
Businesses aren't driven out of business by their customers, they're driven out of business by their inability to compete in a given market.
Granted, the online retailers may have an "unfair" advantage in that they can provide the goods at a cheaper price, but they can't provide that face to face customer service that an LDS can. The shops that survive are going to be the shops that are able to capitalize on this. The shops that die are going to be the ones who not only charge a lot more for gear, but also treat their customers like their doing them a favor by allowing them to buy gear from their shop.
A "good" dive shop would be kind of nice to have around but there just aren't very many.
I've told this story before but some time back my wife and I had a day to kill in the Chicago area. There's lots of shops there. We took a phone book and just went door to door and visited a bunch of them.
You just wouldn't believe the lines we had thrown at us. I'd never send a prospective new diver to any one of them.
I've told this story before but some time back my wife and I had a day to kill in the Chicago area. There's lots of shops there. We took a phone book and just went door to door and visited a bunch of them.
You just wouldn't believe the lines we had thrown at us. I'd never send a prospective new diver to any one of them.
Over time it'll get worked out. I think quite a few manufacturers have already changed some of their policies. The model is going to change but people will still be diving.
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