Last minute cancellations and "no shows"

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Tortuga James

Contributor
Scuba Instructor
Divemaster
Messages
807
Reaction score
136
Location
North Carolina
# of dives
1000 - 2499
I have been watching the "plan a NC dive trip" thread and there is a lot of good advice and information. I would like to take the opportunity to explain the practice of requiring full payment at the time of reservation, and also of waiting to the last minute to cancel the trip due to weather.

Most customers diving the Beaufort area have travelled in and already have accommodations. They want to dive if at all possible. As operators and seasoned Captains, we know when the forecast is one that could swing either way and tend to trust our own observations as opposed to relying solely on the forecast. They get it wrong OFTEN! One of the nicer days I ran on my last trip to Wrightsville for Meg teeth, a local operator cancelled the afternoon before and the forecast turned out to be wrong in our favor. Sometimes it is wrong the other way, like last Saturday when the forecast was light NE winds turning S light in the afternoon. We woke up to gusty 20 kt east winds and driving rain. I had to cancel at the dock. Several other boats did as well.

As far as deposits and pre-payments. I was once told that every policy is the result of someone getting burned. I am flexible with my reservation deposit policy depending on how well I know the customers. Even then, really good customers sometimes cancel the day before for whatever reason. Most times they still pay me for the spot. If not they generally lose their good customer status. I now require a deposit from every new customer to hold a spot. As a six pack, every seat counts and I need some assurance that you will be there (at least financially) before I turn others away because I am full. Just this week I have turned away more folks than I can carry because I am full for the upcoming holiday weekend.

Now let me tie the 2 things together. It clearly should be the operators decision on when to run and when to cancel. But a growing trend is that our customers watch the weather forecast on the internet and want to decide for themselves if it is going to be too rough to go. That is fine as long as you pay for the empty spot you left on the boat. But without much experience and local knowledge, chances are you will get it wrong. No operator is going to go to sea in unsafe conditions. Some may go in less than comfortable conditions, but that is relative to each individual's comfort zone.

No one in the dive boat industry in NC is getting rich. We all operate on tight margins, every seat counts whether it is a crew boat or 6 pack. Most of us do it for love not money, but love doesn't pay the overhead of running a boat. That is why most operations require full payment up front, just like the airlines. The worst thing you can do to a operator like myself who sometimes waives the deposit is to cancel late or not show.

I recently had to split one full boat into 2 days because I had a group of 4 inquiring and only 3 spots open. I asked the solo customer if they were "solid" and he responded definitely and asked to please not sell his spot. So I had to run 2 days with 4 people instead of one day with 6. He said he would go online and make a deposit payment that day. I took him for his word and didn't check to verify. I hadn't heard from him and the day before so I contacted him to make sure he was coming. I got no answer. The next morning, he did not show up. I had to run with 3 divers because I could not punish them for this guy not showing up. When I checked later, he had not made an online payment. Now he will not respond to my communications. So not only am I out the $150 he owes me (it is clear in my cancellation policy) but I had to burn $250 in fuel I would not have had to do if I could have consolidated the groups.

I only explain these things so that as you plan your trip to dive NC you will have an understanding of why things are done the way they are here. And if you have to cancel at the last minute and you haven't paid for your trip, you will understand that you will be asked to pay for it. And if you don't, you can write off ever diving that boat again. And most likely other boats as well, because Captains do talk to each other. Requiring full payment with the reservation eliminates this type of thing ever happening.

Safe Diving,

Captain James
 
As usual, Captain James is correct.

The goal is to provide the best possible dive experience that we can provide, but the bottom line is that you must operate in a businesslike manner or you will not be around very long.
Every policy of the NC dive boat community has origins in the actions of the divers that they serve. Charter policy may vary a bit between operators, but I do believe you will find it fairly consistent on the deposit and weather cancelation issues and they are reasonable based upon the issues involved.

BTW, last Saturday when Tortuga had to cancel we sailed out of Hatteras. All day we watched the storms on the Wx radar just plain hammer Morehead area while we stayed pretty much in the clear just 60 miles to the North. This is why you use a professional operator like Tortuga to make the right decision at the right time.

If you don't like something that an operator is doing, talk to them about it and there may be some mutual ground or understanding. If you want to try and do it better raise at least a hundred grand to get started and buy a dive boat, but don't quit your day job right away...

 
Good information.

It is always Captain's call.

My point was just that there are those rough but not super rough days and different boats have different philosophies on those sort of days. Depending on the divers they can have different choices of which philosophy they prefer.

A lot of the boats in the Keys have very short cancelation policies. Some only 24 hours. No NC boat that I know of has anything that short. Shortest I know of in NC is 4 days. The OP had never dove NC but appeared to have done a fair amount of diving. I thought it good to point out to him that the situation may be different than he is used to in NC. The posts above do a good job of explaining why.
 
steve, your post actually was more than just pointing it out...
you gave some narritave about how because of this policy you use other operations.


the further south you go the longer the dive season becomes.

When no one here is diving in december through feb. the boat payment and slip rent still have to be paid, and the owner still has to eat.. so there is a greater urgency to make every seat count.

Jan, and feb, in florida still has active diving, so the yearly slip costs, boat payments etc can be more evenly spread out.
 
I agree with everything said, but what if I have to cancel on short notice and you are able to fill my seat. Do I get anything back?
 
Some ppl think they are the only ppl on the planet. I would never expect to cancel on short notice and get my money back. Even in case of emergency. I would ask that if someone took my place that you consider it but that's all.

Last year I double booked a dive with 2 different charters. I don't know how but I screwed up the date. I found out that morning what I had done. I felt terrible and told the other boat to charge me, also pay the DM to buddy up with the 3rd diver, and tipped them just as if I were on the boat. Plus I paid the same on the charter I was on. The cost of fuel and the time involved is simply to much to get screwed over. ... especially on a 6 pack where every person counts. I did my best to make it right.

Btw..I was the poster of the NC thread. Ill be contacting you. I've read some post's by you and can tell you run a good operation. I'm really wanting to make this trip work. I mentioned it to my LDS and he said that NC can be tough but it's the most underrated diving destination in the states. He loves it. So now I'm determined!
 
Btw..I was the poster of the NC thread. Ill be contacting you. I've read some post's by you and can tell you run a good operation. I'm really wanting to make this trip work. I mentioned it to my LDS and he said that NC can be tough but it's the most underrated diving destination in the states. He loves it. So now I'm determined!

Sounds like you are the type of customer we are all looking for. Whether it is with us or one of the other operators in the Morehead/Beaufort/Atlantic Beach area or up in Hatteras or down in Wilmington, you owe it to yourself to dive North Carolina. When everything clicks, it is arguably the best diving in the world, not just the states.
 
absolutely

Nice. I've been on boats where this wasn't true. I even found my own replacement after canceling, but wasn't given any refund.

How about this situation I've been in. Go out to wreck site, mate splashes to set the hook and comes up without tying in saying vis and current are too unsafe for diving. Captain returned to port and "graciously" offered half refunds. Did not even offer full credit toward a future trip.
 
and tipped them just as if I were on the boat.

I could not let this go by without a comment. That was a "class act" thing to do. More than once I have reached in my pocket and tipped my mate for a "no show" or clueless tipper.

Contrary to what some believe, North Carolina crew work very hard for their customers. As a practice we don't haul your tanks or set up your gear. And we usually don't make you a sandwich. But every crew member on every boat is very attentive to everything that is going on with every diver. You just might not notice because you are also focusing on your gear and dives. We pay close attention to when you leave the boat and when we expect you back. We make sure you are capable of making the dive, but sometimes things go wrong. When that happens and it was because you were not prepared, then expect a stern "talking to".

Our crew members risk their lives dive bombing to the bottom with hook and chain in hand to make sure you have a solid tie in to the wreck in a spot that will be easy to navigate and return to. Then when you are done, they go back alone and untie it.

We don't pay our crew members. Like the Captains, they do it more for love than money. So at the end of the day, when you have just done 2 prolific dives and you are packing up your gear, reach in your pocket and give the guy that helped make that happen a minimum of $20.
 
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