Kansas Dive Shop Owner arrested for theft from customers

[DandyDon]

It starts with co-mingling of funds collected for gear & trip purchases. Few business are going to set up trust accounts or even separate accounts for those payments. Then with their floods and other problems, the business funds are depleted. Calling it theft is a gray assumption.

If you prepaid cash for an order, then the owner got robbed, you wouldn't call his actions the theft - but you'd still hold him responsible.

 

[Mike Walker]

Yes. Using funds for reasons other than they were allocated for is called theft. Dive shops (and others, I'm sure) do it all the time.

I would suggest this depends on the terms under which the funds were provided.

If his business was acting as a reseller for the trips - took payment and then didn't deliver the goods then this would seem to be a simple breach of contract type situation and a civil matter.

If he personally agreed to hold funds as a trip organizer and then spent them on something else then that would be much closer to actual theft (i.e. a criminal matter).

For him to be arrested I'm assuming it was something closer to the latter - which would indicate he wasn't doing a very good job of running a business assuming the business was it's own legal entity.

One of the reasons to be very clear who/what you are dealing with when providing funds.

(I'm sure there's some lawyer types around here who can phrase this better)

 

[Wookie]

It starts with co-mingling of funds collected for gear & trip purchases. Few business are going to set up trust accounts or even separate accounts for those payments. Then with their floods and other problems, the business funds are depleted. Calling it theft is a gray assumption.

If you prepaid cash for an order, then the owner got robbed, you wouldn't call his actions the theft - but you'd still hold him responsible.

If you pay me for a dive trip, and I use it to repair an engine, and consequently you don't get a dive trip, that's theft.

If I give the dive shop owner control of my money for payment of a dive trip, and he is subsequently robbed of those particular dollars, then he has not exercised his fiduciary responsibility by setting up an escrow account to keep those funds safe, where they couldn't be stolen.

When you bought a dive trip from me, you don't think that money went into my operating account when you sent it to me, do you? Not. One. Cent. It was held in a separate account (called the travel account) that was not transferred to the boat's operating account until the trip was complete, the boat was home and everyone safe, and commissions paid to the dive shops.

Anything less is theft. Call it what you like, but it seems that the DA and the police department of Saline County agrees with me.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

Yes. Using funds for reasons other than they were allocated for is called theft. Dive shops (and others, I'm sure) do it all the time.

Oh yes. When I was at a shop that has since gone under, the owner would take people's money and not order until they were screaming or it was convenient. One guy spent $15K, ultimately having to refund $2K as he never placed all the orders. It is amazing how some people try to operate. I have no knowledge of this particular establishment, but have seen one rather egregious case. Blows my mind. Just what are some people thinking? That's one reason why I need to take some business classes before I open up my shop, especially as I'll be doing it in a foreign country (Greece).

 

[Mike Walker]

Anything less is theft. Call it what you like, but it seems that the DA and the police department of Saline County agrees with me.

Actually they've called it "theft by deception" according to the article. Which seems to be closer to fraud based on a quick google search (which is what I would have assumed for this).

Yes it's being pedantic... but there's a difference between outright stealing some cash and mismanaging funds that you (or your business) have been entrusted with. It sounds like he'd done it enough times that one could interpret his actions as intentional. But he still didn't go up to his customers and lift the cash from their wallets.

(I guess the only point I really have here is that there is some subtly to this that is best left to the cops and lawyers. Simply shouting 'THIEF!' in a public forum probably isn't appropriate without knowing all the details. He would seem less than honest, for sure - but how and to what degree matters.)

 

[Wookie]

Actually they've called it "theft by deception" according to the article. Which seems to be closer to fraud based on a quick google search (which is what I would have assumed for this).

Yes it's being pedantic... but there's a difference between outright stealing some cash and mismanaging funds that you (or your business) have been entrusted with. It sounds like he'd done it enough times that one could interpret his actions as intentional. But he still didn't go up to his customers and lift the cash from their wallets.

I agree with you.

In either case, he isn't going to mismanage anyone elses funds nor spend the money on floods, which his business insurance should have handled.

And, someone is getting their revenge on him.

 

[DandyDon]

If I give the dive shop owner control of my money for payment of a dive trip, and he is subsequently robbed of those particular dollars, then he has not exercised his fiduciary responsibility by setting up an escrow account to keep those funds safe, where they couldn't be stolen.

Oh really? So most trips sellers do set up escrow accounts for trip payments? And it's considered a fiduciary responsibility in the industry?

Always good to have input from the experts and Wookie has a sound reputation.

 

[dead dog]

Simple
He is a thief- e will be convicted as a thief
he will always be a thief

SDM

How true Sam.

 

[DiveAgain5649]

What about those he hasn’t paid back from the one he closed in Wichita?

 

[reddiver970]

So you steal peoples money in Kansas then you move to one of the most expensive places in the country in Vail, Colorado???Or is the Vail part just another BS story to promote an image. I only had one online interaction with that guy and he is an arrogant jerk...turns out those may have been his better qualities.