Judge rules-Abandoned diver can sue charter company

[shoupart]

Thanks, Don Janni.

I too once floated for about 45 minutes alone, during a night dive, before the (private) boat was able to find me. (I had a Light Cannon and a whistle, and it was still difficult)

I am curious to know if any of the people here who are dismissing a "mere four hours" left floating in the ocean have ever had a similar experience of being adrift by themselves at sea, and wondering if they were going to survive or not.

It's easy to be flippant towards it when you haven't personally experienced it.

By the way, I didn't sue or think of suing, because I was just glad to be back on board. I'd made some mistakes and so had the boat operator, but I had no hard feelings or anything. But since I didn't experience anything close to what Drifting Dan did, I'm going to withold judgment.

 

[merxlin]

I reply to many posts above, I don't think anyone is saying that it is a diver's fault for being left, but that there are actions that a diver and/or his buddy(s) can take that can compound a problem. What is of concern is how it happened. Since we have some facts, conjecture, and courtroom theatrics here it is hard to tell what the whole story is. But in this case, it is obvious that at least on this one boat the procedures changed for the better and they have made every effort to make sure no one is ever left behind again. That should not be considered an admission of guilt, but the proper response to a problem. Hopefully it carried over to the other So Cal (if not all) dive ops and we are all a bit safer since then. I can't recall any other divers being stranded since this event.

As far as what this situation warrants in punitive damages, the consensus seems to be somewhere between $1 and his asking price of $4 million. That's why the court is there. Should we be concerned with the amount? I think we should, because it will be reflected in the costs we all pay to dive as dive ops pay more for insurance. I also have some bias against personal awards that seem out of place with the circumstances.

I also find it interesting that we are looking at the boat as the villain here, but what about the shop that chartered the boat? Do they have a responsibility to know who their divers are, and if they were all accounted for? What about the "buddies" that by all accounts did not stay with him or report him missing? How much of this is on their shoulders?

 

[Jim Kerr]

$4 million for 4 hours though? THAT just screams "sue happy" American. THIS is why my insurance rates are so high

Would it sound unreasonable if it were "you" out there in 55 - 65 degree water wondering if you're spending the last moments of your life on earth? 4 hours in tropcal waters would seem like an eternity but 4 hours in California or colder waters?

No, this is a good thing. It will give dive OPs something to think about besides getting back in time for lunch or for the next dive charter.

 

[Teamcasa]

, I don't think anyone is saying that it is a diver's fault for being left, but that there are actions that a diver and/or his buddy(s) can take that can compound a problem….

…..Hopefully it carried over to the other So Cal (if not all) dive ops and we are all a bit safer since then. I can't recall any other divers being stranded since this event.

….I also find it interesting that we are looking at the boat as the villain here, but what about the shop that chartered the boat? Do they have a responsibility to know who their divers are, and if they were all accounted for? What about the "buddies" that by all accounts did not stay with him or report him missing? How much of this is on their shoulders?

Mike, The boat Captain is the final arbitrator and decision maker on when to leave a site, This is why many blame the boat. If the Captain empowered a third party to manage the divers, does this relieve the Captain of his responsibility? Probably not in the eyes of the insurance carrier or the plaintiff’s lawyers. It is left to the courts to decide.

As for this incident improving the safety of all divers on charters, I hope so but I have found the concern and attention to safety, both on the SunDiver as well as the other boats I have been on, a top priority.

Instant Buddies. That is a whole other topic. In this case, and since I admittedly do not have any first hand information I just don’t know but after doing some internet research, it appears he left them shortly after not being able to equalize and they never came looking for him after he surfaced. Should they have a share in the blame? I simply do not have enough real information do say one way or the other but you would think they would at least figure out they were missing a man when they surfaced.

Let me add one more thought. The Captain and crew of the SunDiver have always treated me with respect and I have had good times aboard their boat. They take safety seriously and I would not discourage divers from chartering with them. However, I did poke fun about their speed and have been in communication with them about it. To say the least, they were not to happy about my comments. I encouraged them to post a response but I realize commenting on a public forum about a pending case is not a good idea. So, in fairness, I’ll do it for them. (Only about the speed.)

The SunDiver is an older boat, well maintained and sound. With the high price of fuel, their choice of speed is a direct reflection on this and currently, most of the other dive charters have dropped a knot or two in an effort to keep the cost of diving competitive. Fair enough.

 

[merxlin]

Good points Dave. I too have made jokes about the speed of the boat, but don't hesitate to dive it and do so frequently.

I think one problem with this topic is that it is old news. The occurrence was 4 years ago. I hope we all take a look at what safety procedures are in place on the boats we dive NOW, and that they are where they should be. I'll never complain about being asked to poke my face out the head door for a final roll call because I know why it's being done.

 

[Rick Murchison]

... No, this is a good thing. It will give dive OPs something to think about besides getting back in time for lunch or for the next dive charter.

I dont' think it's a "good thing" at all.
While a "good thing" is the adoption of procedures that absolutely assure no one is accidentaly left behind, that can be accomplished without setting an industry-killing precedent.
If this case resets the needed policy limits ceiling high enough, many if not most of us won't be able to afford to dive off a commercial boat anymore, and without us, most commercial boats will simply stop selling diving spots.
Nope... not "a good thing" at all.
Rick

 

[Rich452]

'assumption of risk' can be a legal defense whether or not there is a singed liablility waiver

 

[Rich452]

btw - that should 'signed', unless the waiver has been scorched

 

[Skeeter1097]

I am my dive buddy was lost at sea for over two hours. It was cloudy when we dropped. When we Came up 45 minutes later it would seam that we interred a new world. The seas where up the rain was coming down it was dark and the wind was blowing. We hooked off to get some lobster am the ball went down. The boat lost the float.
We where not left out there. Every dive boat, cost Gard boat and some privet boats where looking for us. We where picked up 2hr 15min after servicing.
But to leave a diver and not know if you have everyone. No I cant except that.
Sink the boat.!!!!!

 

[mike_s]

The bottom line here is that if a large award is made, all of us will end up paying higher prices for dive boats, because liability insurance rates will skyrocket for everyone in the business.
The same sort of thing all but killed general aviation, and could do the same for the diving industry.
That sucks.
Rick

So who's fault is that?

Is it the divers fault for filing the lawsuit?

or the dive boats fault for leaving him?