Jet Fins A short US history

[John C. Ratliff]

Sam,

It is obvious that my posts have been mis-interpreted, it certainly was not my intention to come in here and de-value equipment of days gone by, but a tirade like yours above is both unnecessary and unwarranted.

I found this thread through the "New Posts" link, I didn't notice it was in the Vintage section and am not sure why that matters??

I may not have been diving in the 60s (like one of my former dive buddies) or have thousands of dives, but I am very much interested in the history of this sport. I would like to collect and preserve older equipment, not necessarily to dive but to try a prevent it becoming lost.

None of what I wrote was supposed to cause offence, (unlike your post quoted above), and to be honest, I struggle to see how it has, but far be it for me to say what someone does or does not find offensive and so if anyone has been upset by my comments then I apologise as it is not what I meant.

I enjoyed Dr. Sam Miller's post, because it was funny and satiric. Not too many people would even remember the Duck Feet, but realize that the newer plastic fins did not have the same properties as gum rubber--they were just cheaper to produce.

When I was in the USAF, we had a different reason for liking the Duck Feet; we made parascuba jumps, and needed either a full-foot fin or a fin without buckles for our jumps. This is because if we hit the slip stream of the HC-130's engines when we jumped at a wrong angle (greater than 100 knots air speed), we would be flipped and spun all sorts of directions. Fins with buckles would tend to get hung up on our deploying suspension lines and we could end up upside down. Also, in the water, we had 32 different suspension lines around us at times, and getting those tangled in the buckle of our fin could be a problem, especially if the water wasn't flat calm. So the Duck Feet and the USD Aqualung fins were used quite a bit, along with AMF Voit's Viking fin. The Viking V66 fin was the only one that was made large enough for one of our PJs, Don Beasley who was 6'11" tall and wore a huge size shoe, to fit into over wet suit booties. Here's a photo of a PJ in Okinawa (now part of Japan) on a parascuba jump:

We figured out a way to use the fins with buckles when the Duck Feet were either inapprapriate (with full wet suits for cold water) or had ceased to be produced; we threaded the heel strap backwards, so that the loose end of the strap was inside the strap and not outside where it could hang up. Also, we used masking tape to tape our fins on (not duct tape; masking tape came off much easier) so that we did not have buckles showing and so that the air blast would not tear off our fins. In the 1970s I was issued Lightning Jet Fins by the USAF for these purposes.

The PJs today don't do the same static line jumps, as they mostly do HiLo (High altitude, Low opening) jumps even for water jumps.

SeaRat

 

[duckbill]

we threaded the heel strap backwards, so that the loose end of the strap was inside the strap and not outside where it could hang up.

That's how I learned to wear fins. It was standard NAUI SOP for kelp country. I hope it still is. You can also spot a kelp-trained diver by the knife strapped to the inside of his calf.

 

[Nemrod]

That's how I learned to wear fins. It was standard NAUI SOP for kelp country. I hope it still is. You can also spot a kelp-trained diver by the knife strapped to the inside of his calf.

Me too, but, I tell you as much as I though spring straps were "stupid" at first, I have to tell you, I am now a convert after four years with them now, or is it three, whatever, I like them now.

N

 

[Puffer Fish]

I enjoyed Dr. Sam Miller's post, because it was funny and satiric. Not too many people would even remember the Duck Feet, but realize that the newer plastic fins did not have the same properties as gum rubber--they were just cheaper to produce.

When I was in the USAF, we had a different reason for liking the Duck Feet; we made parascuba jumps, and needed either a full-foot fin or a fin without buckles for our jumps. This is because if we hit the slip stream of the HC-130's engines when we jumped at a wrong angle (greater than 100 knots air speed), we would be flipped and spun all sorts of directions. Fins with buckles would tend to get hung up on our deploying suspension lines and we could end up upside down. Also, in the water, we had 32 different suspension lines around us at times, and getting those tangled in the buckle of our fin could be a problem, especially if the water wasn't flat calm. So the Duck Feet and the USD Aqualung fins were used quite a bit, along with AMF Voit's Viking fin. The Viking V66 fin was the only one that was made large enough for one of our PJs, Don Beasley who was 6'11" tall and wore a huge size shoe, to fit into over wet suit booties. Here's a photo of a PJ in Okinawa (now part of Japan) on a parascuba jump:

We figured out a way to use the fins with buckles when the Duck Feet were either inapprapriate (with full wet suits for cold water) or had ceased to be produced; we threaded the heel strap backwards, so that the loose end of the strap was inside the strap and not outside where it could hang up. Also, we used masking tape to tape our fins on (not duct tape; masking tape came off much easier) so that we did not have buckles showing and so that the air blast would not tear off our fins. In the 1970s I was issued Lightning Jet Fins by the USAF for these purposes.

The PJs today don't do the same static line jumps, as they mostly do HiLo (High altitude, Low opening) jumps even for water jumps.

SeaRat

Wow, that sure brought back memories. Just for the record, the army did the same thing in the 70's..

One thing.. did we have duct tape back then? I honestly don't remember. I do remember the masking tape though.

 

[John C. Ratliff]

Yup, duct (duck) tape was around then:

Duct Tape History - Invention of Duct Tape

But we needed something that could come off fairly easily. We used masking tape on our tanks too, as we had a valve protector over the manifold, and then used masking tape over that to make a nice clean surface so that the suspension lines would not catch. The masking tape did well to keep the fins (Duck Feet in the beginning) on too when we hit that blast of air exiting from the side doors of the HC-130 Hercules (Hercy bird) or the HU-16B Albatross.

I had my Duck Feet and my Aqualung fins in the pool today, and enjoyed both a lot. The Duck Feet fit my feet well with just a pair of running socks; the Aqualung were a bit big. Both provided a lot of thrust when I kicked, using either the dolphin kick or the modified flutter kick (divers don't really "flutter" kick, but widen it out with fins). Nemrod, you started your fin studies yet?

SeaRat

 

[burna]

I enjoyed Dr. Sam Miller's post, because it was funny and satiric. ...

SeaRat

Well, I suppose it was funny in that it was ironic. Unleashing a personal attack to tell me that I was being dis-respectful!

I didn't question or comment on anyone's achievements, experience, knowledge or age.

And, paying out on a newer diver with less than 100 dives is a great way to promote interest in "the history of this great sport ", nice one! And with a comment like "...late model tube sucking bubble blower..." one can only assume that Mr Miller (and others) was never a new diver himself.

I am still yet to find out exactly how I was dis-respectful, and the lack of an explanation from Mr Miller would certainly seem to indicate he doesn't have one.

 

[mdb]

burna:

You did nothing wrong. You came on to "new posts" and you asked a legit question. Keep posting.

There is a lot to learn here even from us old folks.

We do have a great sport. We explore the UW world, which most people never see.

As we say in the Marine Corps-"Welcome Aboard".

 

[John C. Ratliff]

Well, I suppose it was funny in that it was ironic. Unleashing a personal attack to tell me that I was being dis-respectful!

I didn't question or comment on anyone's achievements, experience, knowledge or age.

And, paying out on a newer diver with less than 100 dives is a great way to promote interest in "the history of this great sport ", nice one! And with a comment like "...late model tube sucking bubble blower..." one can only assume that Mr Miller (and others) was never a new diver himself.

I am still yet to find out exactly how I was dis-respectful, and the lack of an explanation from Mr Miller would certainly seem to indicate he doesn't have one.

Well, I'm an early model, double tube sucking bubble blower, I sometimes hold my breath and do it by myself a lot too. Don't take what Dr. Miller said in that post about you too seriously; just let it flow off like Oregon rain on Goretex. Dr. Miller has a lot of information that is important for us to hear, so I'm happy that he is posting.

I took my Duck Feet into the water a few days back, and they preform very well. But these did not work out well upside down like I talked about earlier. The foot pocket was not comfortable upside down, as the pocket is pretty square and hit my tarsal bone pretty hard, even with socks on. As I said earlier, the Jet Fin had the advantage of a better-designed foot pocket. With the AMF Voit modification, the foot pocket became better-designed. But if you put a good kick into Duck Feet fins, you get a great response; same with the USD Aqualung, which I also used on Monday morning. Here's another photo of a diver (Bob Means, my dive buddy through the US Navy Underwater Swimmers School) on our deep qualifying dive in 1967 out of Key West, Florida.

SeaRat

 

[Tortuga68]

I am still yet to find out exactly how I was dis-respectful, and the lack of an explanation from Mr Miller would certainly seem to indicate he doesn't have one.

...or maybe he'd rather the thread be about Jet Fins

May I suggest you send him a PM if you wish to continue the discussion

 

[Puffer Fish]

Well, I suppose it was funny in that it was ironic. Unleashing a personal attack to tell me that I was being dis-respectful!

I didn't question or comment on anyone's achievements, experience, knowledge or age.

And, paying out on a newer diver with less than 100 dives is a great way to promote interest in "the history of this great sport ", nice one! And with a comment like "...late model tube sucking bubble blower..." one can only assume that Mr Miller (and others) was never a new diver himself.

I am still yet to find out exactly how I was dis-respectful, and the lack of an explanation from Mr Miller would certainly seem to indicate he doesn't have one.

When Sam was a new diver, there were only other new divers.

It is pretty obvious that you did not mean to be disrespectful in your post, but passing judgement on equipment you have never used, when almost everyone one else posting here has, is not showing showing any historical respect for the history of the sport or those that lived it.

On the flip side, being told off by one of the legendary people in the history of diving, is, in it self, pretty impressive. Hopefully, one day way in the future you can tell about the time you got called a "tube sucking bubble blower" by Sam.

I've been an instructor for 35 years, but by comparison to Sam, I'm still a newbie.

I respectfully suggest that you spend a bit more time asking questions. There are a fair number of people here that have a tremendous amount of experience to share.