Is this Offensive?

[Gombessa]

There are some here (not necessarily "tech" divers, either, but definitely those who feel they've been around and paid their dues) who simply lack tact. "I've used those fins and they're absolutely worthless." "That jacket BC is garbage." "What good will that do in a cave/wreck?"

The good news is that it's always easy to spot these types of comments. The hard part is telling yourself to disregard them accordingly.

 

[Cave Diver]

I don't want to sound rude but it seems like every tech diver takes offense to little suggestions made by the recreational crowd.
Whether it be the ever hated Split Fin, redundant guages, BCD choice, etc.

I am just curious as I read some of the responses to "New to Diving" posts, what is the general opinion out there. Is it offensive to the highly trained tech crowd that we give a seemingly one sided answer, assuming that a new diver has little intention to cave dive (which by the way kudos to all of those that do this. That is a level of bravery beyond me)/ or has little need for a fancy tech computer.

There always seems to be a certain amount of hostility between the cliques as a post grows. Am I reading too much into things or is there a reason for my suspicions?

Please PM me if you think I am out of line. As I said I am not trying to insult anyone, I'm just curious.

I don't think it's so much that tech divers "take offense." I think it is more along the lines of the parent that answers a childs' question for the umpteenth time and starts sounding a bit exasperated.

Tech divers, by the very nature of their commitment, tend to be among the most active divers. They also tend to be more critical of gear and looking at it to see what it brings to the table. If they find it lacking, they tend to be very vocal on that point.
Many have a closet full of gear that they bought when the didn't know what they didn't know.

Yes, a lot of posts come across as brash. But we, as readers, always have the option of ignoring a poster, or logging off. With a little patience you'll learn who to listen to and who to ignore and your experience here on :sblogo: will be much richer for it.

 

[In10se]

 

[Doc]

Muscle Car or Sports Car? There is more than one way to get around a race track.

The owner of one or the other thing will defend their purchasing decision (and dive style) as if it were a religion.

Personal styles while in the process of formation tend to gravitate towards regimented processes. In diving, arguably this is not such a bad thing. Unfortunately, very few divers will adapt their gear choices to the challenges of the specific dive at hand.

I remember how the British divers would show up for their first Caribbean trip with dangling wrenches, wreck reels and lift bags. People come to warm water pretty fish havens, all decked out in double tech wings, cave reels, 30 cu ft ponies, canister lights and all sorts of extraneous hardware.

Not having the dive experience to know how to (as the Brits call it) "kit up" for specific dive environments is an issue of training and lack of reacting to pre-trip research. What will my needs be on this specific dive? To gear up the same way for every environment is not only foolish, it can be dangerous.

By always following the pre-printed dogma of any "dive process" without ultimately evolving to their own style utilizing logical choices and selecting the best elements from each of the dive religions is at worst indicative of narrow or limited thinking, and at best, a formative stage in the maturation of the diver. This is either from lack of personal experience and self confidence or most often- peer pressure.

It is a positive affirmation that one has made the right choices. To ignore the several quite brilliantly conceived schools of dive thought would be equally foolish. Study them all, become and advanced practitioner of all their tenets, but do not be afraid to take what you have learned and apply that with your logical mind.

So, no- there will be no shortage of conflict over the world shaking issues of MOF, Splits or Force Fins, BPW vs BCD, PADI vs GUE, or all of that high level stuff that occupies bandwidth. Not even fins versus flippers!

Among those who must cling to their beliefs, the hardest thing is letting go.

 

[bfw]

I don't want to sound rude but it seems like every tech diver takes offense to little suggestions made by the recreational crowd.
Whether it be the ever hated Split Fin, redundant guages, BCD choice, etc.

So, let me get this straight. You have a group that has spent thousands upon thousands of man hours sorting out these questions, based on decades of experience, accident reports, etc. Then you have a group of people with little to no experience, commitment, or time spent contemplating these issues. When the latter group starts gushing about some new gimmick promoted to them by someone with a profit motive, and the former group doesn't embrace it, you attribute this to irrational rage?

Regarding your statement that everyone is not a cave diver, the housewife taking the minivan to the supermarket still can be safer by applying what grand prix drivers have learned about the proper placement of a safety belt, even if it does wrinkle her skirt. Get it?

 

[bfw]

Muscle Car or Sports Car? There is more than one way to get around a race track..

Except when the issue is tailfins or 4 wheel disk brakes, or, down the road, new brake pads or spinner wheel covers, which, in a lot of these questions, it is.

 

[Gombessa]

When the latter group starts gushing about some new gimmick promoted to them by someone with a profit motive, and the former group doesn't embrace it, you attribute this to irrational rage?

I think the point is that experience need not lead to hostility. Your explanation makes it seem like it's wholly unreasonable for new divers to act like new divers.

 

[Doc]

Except when the issue is tailfins or 4 wheel disk brakes, or, down the road, new brake pads or spinner wheel covers, which, in a lot of these questions, it is.

True enough. The vast majority of SMB's are purely ornamental.

 

[bfw]

I think the point is that experience need not lead to hostility. Your explanation makes it seem like it's wholly unreasonable for new divers to act like new divers.

Well, it would be nice if they acted like they understood basic economics and the fact that every new toy isn't necessarily better just because the people who profit from its sale say it is. However, I think perhaps the characterization of the response as "hostile" is also a manifestation of the same wide-eyed emotionalism that led to what you call "acting like new divers" in the first place. Typically, what I see is this:

New diver gets all excited over new gimmick, maybe buys it, and proceeds to tell a bunch of experienced tech divers how it's going to do everything but give the US energy independence. Tech diver says it's not really and improvement, it's a solution in search of a problem, and it's actually a step backward. New diver gets more insistent, having personalized it and tied his feelings of validity as a diver to the legitimacy of his big idea. Tech diver then tells him he doesn't know enough to know what he doesn't know, and all of a sudden, new diver is in an emotional tizzy about how "hostile" those mean old tech divers are.

One more example how the fetish for emoting rather than thinking is wrecking civilization.

 

[bfw]

True enough. The vast majority of SMB's are purely ornamental.

Cute, but let's face it, a large obstacle to wider market acceptance of BP/wing setups is they don't come in fashionable colors. Monster gauge consoles are the fuzzy dice of the diving world.