Is there an instructor crisis?

[wetb4igetinthewater]

Sorry, the student did not demonstrate mastery as defined by PADI, so signing the student off wouold have been a lie.

And? What's your point? That's the reality. Student didn't drown while completing skill, so check them off and move on.

Definition​

During confined and open water dives, mastery is defined as performing the skill so it meets the stated performance requirements in a reasonably comfortable, fluid, repeatable manner as would be expected of a diver at that certification level​

And how many times do you think students demonstrate skills more than once?

Everyone knows how mastery is far too often interpreted. Everyone. Agencies (not just PADI), shops, and instructors alike. "Good enough!"

 

[boulderjohn]

And? What's your point? That's the reality. Student didn't drown while completing skill, so check them off and move on.

And how many times do you think students demonstrate skills more than once?

Everyone knows how mastery is far too often interpreted. Everyone. Agencies (not just PADI), shops, and instructors alike. "Good enough!"

So if I were to summarize your recent posts in this thread, you seem to be saying, as usual, that the instructors, who from all indications are making minimum wage or less, are grossly overpaid for their shoddy work.

You (and others in this thread) are doing your best to illustrate what I wrote earlier--a large percentage of ScubaBoard posters (you especially) continually insist that instructors do not deserve to make a living wage.

 

[SlugLife]

But again, who’s fault is it with the current situation?
What is it about teaching that has them lined up willing to work for next to nothing?

The artist industry frequently runs into a similar problem. People love creating art so much, that many new artists are tricked/manipulated/convinced into working for next to nothing.

There's also somewhat common (IMO bad) advice to "do what you have to, to get your foot in the door." Meanwhile, there are many businessmen types who know this all too well, and will approach one-artist-after-another until one of them agrees to work for free. Typically they'll say something like "think of all the publicity you'll get", leaving out the part where that publicity is approximately worth the $0 they're paying you.

How do you break this cycle? Generally, this is where I've had the most success:

1. If you ever work for free, it must be pure charity or probono. You're better off building your own brand and client-base, perhaps offering a free finning lesson or equivalent, than getting almost nothing from a shop, whose charging customers hundreds of $.
2. Be a "mercenary." Employers aren't your friends, even the nice ones. Work for whoever makes you the best offer, in terms of what they pay and what is expected in return. Seek and take better offers as they become available. The only person who genuinely looks out for your best interest is you, even if your boss does a damn good job pretending to be your best friend (even if they genuinely mean it).
3. Consider freelance work and cutting out the middle-man. There are some obvious complexities here, you have to do your own marketing, book-keeping, etc. It's worth doing some reading on running a freelance operation. I don't know about any scuba-specific books, but even the ones I've read designed for artists generally have a number of useful thing to learn. For example, if running your business, your cost must also compensate for time and resources spent outside the class itself.
4. References are money. References are how you move from crappy-job, to less-crappy job. References are how you get clients that recommend you to other clients. References are the way to avoid spending exorbitant amounts of money on advertising. This is true of freelance or even normal jobs. 3b: Make trusted friends in the industry. When you're over-booked or get requests for a class you don't teach, send potential customers to people you trust. Ideally, that person also sends customers your way, when they're overbooked or get requests outside their specialty.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

So if I were to summarize your recent posts in this thread, you seem to be saying, as usual, that the instructors, who from all indications are making minimum wage or less, are grossly overpaid for their shoddy work.

No, I am saying that the standards as written and the complicity of the agencies is responsible for the shoddy training. Tighten up the quality control (a whole different topic)

You (and others in this thread) are doing your best to illustrate what I wrote earlier--a large percentage of ScubaBoard posters (you especially) continually insist that instructors do not deserve to make a living wage.

That again is your conclusion based upon your interesting way of looking at things.

I don't get why you are so against reform to improve dive training. Do you (or anyone) really think the status quo is healthy?

 

[scubaozy]

Maybe its not a bad thing that insurance prices went up. If member fees were also very high, only pro's would remain in the business, hobbyist would pull back. Dropping numbers of instructors will eventually balance price of the courses globally. Dive shops also would be forced to pay more to the instructors. I cannot get over how cheap owd course prices are.. Sometimes I go to a training or a seminar paid by my employer and 3-4 days listening to power point presentation, few fancy handouts is often costing 3-5k..

 

[JonnieB]

Now both are almost gone. The local guys have all died out or quit and the vacationers are not there either. I think they go to Hawaii or somewhere to get certified.

Can you blame them...get certified in Monterey Bay or the Caribbean/Hawaii? That's an easy one!

 

[DiveTucson]

I have stayed out of this thread until now and will probably regret this as well. When I first became an OWSI I was working for a local shop that would only pay in gear credit, store credit, etc. I was the only instructor who had a problem with this and I bet there were 20+ instructors on the roster for that shop and there still are probably 20* today. All the other instructors were mainly retired professionals from other industries or teaching for “fun” and didn’t need and/or even want the income. Based on my needs this was not sustainable and taught me a ton about the dive industry as a whole.

Needless to say I left that shop and became fully independent with my teaching. I was already tech diving a lot when I started teaching so I moved down the tech instructor road as for me that is where the most potential income was and the diving I was most passionate about. I now instruct full time and do just fine with earning an income as a full time dive instructor. I travel a ton as my home base is in Arizona but I’m there about 10 days a month. The other time is spent on teaching in North Florida or Mexico and running CCR focused trips worldwide.

I also just wanted to add that there are way more full time instructors teaching than you guys (ScubaBoard) believe. I can name a 1/2 dozen in North Florida, several in Southern California and WAY more if we consider the Mexican Riveria the two places I split most of my time teaching. None of these guys are making it only teaching open water though so maybe that is the difference

Anyway full time instruction can be possible. Is it possible teaching only open water probably not as there are far too many hobbyist instructors and not even actual professionals. I think that this is a problem created by the shops with pushing everyone to “Go Pro” just my two cents. Now to get out of bed and head to the water…

 

[happy-diver]

What a terrific post mate, I can feel it in my heart good on you

Go DiveTucson fairdinkum scuba instructor

 

[VikingDives]

I have stayed out of this thread until now and will probably regret this as well. When I first became an OWSI I was working for a local shop that would only pay in gear credit, store credit, etc. I was the only instructor who had a problem with this and I bet there were 20+ instructors on the roster for that shop and there still are probably 20* today. All the other instructors were mainly retired professionals from other industries or teaching for “fun” and didn’t need and/or even want the income. Based on my needs this was not sustainable and taught me a ton about the dive industry as a whole.

Needless to say I left that shop and became fully independent with my teaching. I was already tech diving a lot when I started teaching so I moved down the tech instructor road as for me that is where the most potential income was and the diving I was most passionate about. I now instruct full time and do just fine with earning an income as a full time dive instructor. I travel a ton as my home base is in Arizona but I’m there about 10 days a month. The other time is spent on teaching in North Florida or Mexico and running CCR focused trips worldwide.

I also just wanted to add that there are way more full time instructors teaching than you guys (ScubaBoard) believe. I can name a 1/2 dozen in North Florida, several in Southern California and WAY more if we consider the Mexican Riveria the two places I split most of my time teaching. None of these guys are making it only teaching open water though so maybe that is the difference

Anyway full time instruction can be possible. Is it possible teaching only open water probably not as there are far too many hobbyist instructors and not even actual professionals. I think that this is a problem created by the shops with pushing everyone to “Go Pro” just my two cents. Now to get out of bed and head to the water…

What's the percentage of the instructors you mention that teach tech?

 

[berndo]

I also just wanted to add that there are way more full time instructors teaching than you guys (ScubaBoard) believe. I can name a 1/2 dozen in North Florida, several in Southern California and WAY more if we consider the Mexican Riveria the two places I split most of my time teaching.

The OP and pretty much all the posts were about OW instructors though. Teaching CCR and cave/tx is a different story. You can make a living doing that but only in regions people travel to, or places with high population and high income.
You guys are reliant on PADI type OW instructors... If PADI/SSI were to stop or significantly reduce the numbers of OW divers they pump out, you'd be out of business in no time. Out of a few hundred OW divers produced, 1 or 2 (if that) will end up being your customer.

If it weren't for the hobby instructors and the instructors in Mexico, Thailand, etc. that work full time for 800 bucks a month, there wouldn't be much of a dive industry left.