Is criticism of Moderators a bannable offense?

[H2Andy]

I just do not see where it is anyone's business but the person who received the ban & the staff. Not everyone on SB who receives a ban wants it publicized, no matter how vaguely, to the general membership.

certainly i am not suggesting that every time a ban takes place an announcement be made. that would be counter-productive and possibly embarrasing to the banned member, and we don't want that

no, what i am suggesting is that *IF* a thread gets started about so-and-so getting banned, for the benefit of the membership and the sanity of the Mods, two things should happen

1. an official post be made on that thread, basically saying "Yes, ABC was banned for [for example] using sexual language against TOS repeatedly despite multiple warnings."

and

2. Have no other Mods or Staff or comment on the thread but let it die of its own volition.

why?

it informs the members of what is going on; and

it puts the official explanation out there so that the only thing heard is not members complaining and Mods defending the ban

and if someone comes rumour-monguering, those of us paying attention can point to the official reason and say "there it is. now, you need to wait for ABC and ask them yourself if you want to know more."

 

[The Kraken]

But it still gets me back to the point, why is it any of anyone's business other than the banned member and board.

Do people go to the president of the company for which they work and demand that he tell them why a certain person was let go? I certainly do see that happening.

Isn't that analagous to ScubaBoard?

the K

 

[H2Andy]

well, it's true ...

it really is nobody's business why someone got banned

the only question is, why are you protecting someone who broke TOS, if by protecting them all you are doing is increasing ill-will amongst other members?
it does give the appearance of a cover-up, of inability to be held accountable, and of secrecy and underhandedness

it's certainly a high-minded attitude, but perhaps not the most beneficial to ScubaBoard staff

 

[The Kraken]

I guess the source of the ill will should be identified and treated.

I elect to defer to the right of privacy of the individual than to serve up chum to the National Enquirer like curiosity of uninvolved individuals.

Just my position. Some will agree, others won't. But my life will continue.

It's just an internet forum.

the K

 

[H2Andy]

I guess the source of the ill will should be identified and treated.

i guess i shouldn't call it ill will ... but rather unhappiness... the source is a sense of unfairness and unnacountability on the part of the Mods

my suggestions were meant to address that

It's just an internet forum.

it's people on an internet forum. and people need to feel they are being treated with respect, and that others who have power don't use that power unfairly and randomly

i don't believe that is the case

i believe it is a case of poor communication from the Mods to the members

thus, in my view, the solution is better communications from the Mods to the members

hence my various suggestions

let me put it another way:

you all are doing good. real good.

it's a shame that how good you are doing isn't coming across to members. you are letting golden opportunities go to show what you do and how you do it and how hard you work at being fair

change that. communicate all that to the members. you can make two or three small changes that will go a LONG WAY to letting members understand why and how you take certain actions. an informed membership is a happy membership. the converse is also true.

on that note, i'll shut up. the rest is all up to you.

ok, i'll try with one last metaphor:

you are a great company with terrible client relations. get a client relations section. empower them to deal with the members, answer qeustions, etc. ,and act as a buffer between the enforcers and the members.

their job should not be to justify what the Mods have done, but to explain why it was done, and how, and show that it all follows a pattern, a certain order, that it's not all random and a Mod can just show up and ban someone at whim.

when questions are raised by members, let them raise them with the client relations staff. keep the Mods from jumping in and defending their actions. that just leads to further polarization.

you want to break this cycle:

--good action is taken

-- good action is perceived incorrectly

--members complain

--Mods object to members complaining

--members object to Mods objecting

--other members jump in with their issues

--other Mods jump in with their issues

pretty soon, the good action is lost in all the shuffle.

put on the breaks. communicate early. let the good action shine forth.

 

[Marvel]

That's all well & good, Andy but The Kraken's analogy was the better one. I'll change it a little. You don't go to your HR department to find out why so-&-so got a warning letter, had a suspension, or was let go. Not only would they not release that information to you, it's just plain none of your business. The same holds true here. If a member feels that he/she was fairly untreated by the staff, he/she can contact Pete & appeal the action. It is not your job to decide if the action was fair or not, it is Pete's.

If a banned member wants to share communication that they received from staff with all of y'all privately, that's their option- we cannot stop anyone from forwarding a PM or an email to anyone that they choose. Other than that, it is nobody else's business & I do not believe that we are going to change that policy.

There have been other good suggestions, such as posting a notice if a thread is pulled so that y'all aren't just left flat-footed. That is extremely reasonable & as I said earlier, we'll definitely talk about that & let you all know.

 

[dlndavid]

cool beans

 

[HowardE]

It's just an internet forum.

Is this the attitude we should expect from mods and advisors?

--

Marvel - I wasn't necessarily asking for reasons that members were/are banned. I agree that should be up to those whom are banned, whether or not they want to share that with anyone else.

I was more speaking about simple explanations for deletion of threads that mysteriously vanish overnight.

Generally when a thread is closed, it is stated why. But when a thread is deleted without a trace, it's just that... gone.

If things weren't conducted like secret police, people wouldn't think that there is a secret police force

 

[letterboy]

What about when a thread is to be deleted, delete all posts but the first post make a mod post the only response stating why it was cleaned and closed. Then instead of deleting it leave it up but closed.

 

[Marvel]

Is this the attitude we should expect from mods and advisors?

Actually, I think it's a pretty darned healthy one, Howard. Life balance & all that.

Marvel - I wasn't necessarily asking for reasons that members were/are banned. I agree that should be up to those whom are banned, whether or not they want to share that with anyone else.

I was more speaking about simple explanations for deletion of threads that mysteriously vanish overnight.

Generally when a thread is closed, it is stated why. But when a thread is deleted without a trace, it's just that... gone.

If things weren't conducted like secret police, people wouldn't think that there is a secret police force

Caught that, &, as I've said in 2 different posts, we'll talk about it & let y'all know. I KNOW that everyone wants an instant answer but most policy changes are discussed by the advisors first.

Letterboy, your idea is a good one but doesn't always work for several reasons. There are threads started that violate the ToS in such a fashion that they will not be left out. Also, threads that we get to before any posts are made- we'll PM the OP. Last, if a thread is fast-moving & we don't see it in time, we are NOT going to delete 20-50 or more posts & just to leave the first one up. Please let us have some time to play too!