Very fun reading thread, right now im not DIR and dive a BP but moving in the DIR direction. To me anyone rescue certed should be aquanted with most gear configs . Typical shore dives here , you will incounter all different setups . The one you save may not even be someone in your group.
Insights from Rescue for BP/W users
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ghostdiver1957
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Here is my opinion... and it's just that... for what 2 cents it is worth...
There is nothing wrong with diving Back Plates and Wings in and of itself. The problem lies in that not many people are using them. Now there may be areas of the country and within specific little groups of divers (that have been sold on their benefits) that this is not true... however I've been diving a lot - in fact, I dive almost every day... and no matter where I go on earth, there might be 1 or 2 BP/W set ups for every 20 divers.
Usually these are set up by advanced divers, often aspiring tech divers with specific configurations etc... The average recreational diver is not using them... and the average person taking the Rescue course is not using them. My entire point here is that using them to take classes amongst a group of people that will never use them and likely never even see someone with one on, is ridiculous. People should train with people of like minds. If everyone you're ever going to dive with is wearing a regular old jacket style or back inflate BC... then do your rescue practices in that gear. If everyone is wearing BP/W then by all means use them in the class. Mixing the two is confusing and accomplishes nothing.
For those that might argue that it is good for each to know and understand what the other is wearing, there is some validity to that... however most likely, things that aren't seen, worked with and practiced regularly will likely be lost on most... and the benefit of having learned with it is lost as well.
I'm an Instructor, Dive Guide, Dive Business Owner and have been diving all over the world... I would honestly say that outside of tech divers, less than 1 in 100 divers is diving BP/W... and while that number is slightly increasing... it is simply because LDS's are brainwashing people into spending more money for something that is less efficient and more costly to the diver.
Again, these are my opinions, but they are backed by experience... so Happy Diving to All.
There is nothing wrong with diving Back Plates and Wings in and of itself. The problem lies in that not many people are using them. Now there may be areas of the country and within specific little groups of divers (that have been sold on their benefits) that this is not true... however I've been diving a lot - in fact, I dive almost every day... and no matter where I go on earth, there might be 1 or 2 BP/W set ups for every 20 divers.
Usually these are set up by advanced divers, often aspiring tech divers with specific configurations etc... The average recreational diver is not using them... and the average person taking the Rescue course is not using them. My entire point here is that using them to take classes amongst a group of people that will never use them and likely never even see someone with one on, is ridiculous. People should train with people of like minds. If everyone you're ever going to dive with is wearing a regular old jacket style or back inflate BC... then do your rescue practices in that gear. If everyone is wearing BP/W then by all means use them in the class. Mixing the two is confusing and accomplishes nothing.
For those that might argue that it is good for each to know and understand what the other is wearing, there is some validity to that... however most likely, things that aren't seen, worked with and practiced regularly will likely be lost on most... and the benefit of having learned with it is lost as well.
I'm an Instructor, Dive Guide, Dive Business Owner and have been diving all over the world... I would honestly say that outside of tech divers, less than 1 in 100 divers is diving BP/W... and while that number is slightly increasing... it is simply because LDS's are brainwashing people into spending more money for something that is less efficient and more costly to the diver.
Again, these are my opinions, but they are backed by experience... so Happy Diving to All.
pakman
Contributor
ghostdiver1957:
OK you're entitled to your opinion but if the chances that a rescue diver might come across a rec diver with a bpw (you even say maybe 1 or 2 out of 20 divers, but even if it was 1 out of 100 or more), shouldn't the rescue diver be aware of these bpw setups? As a certified rescue diver myself, I would want to know about all the various setups I might face in an emergency situation.
ghostdiver1957
Contributor
pakman:
Being prepared for anything you might encounter is a noble and wise thought - however it is also unrealistic. In the military and for that matter, everywhere in life, you must be ready to improvise, adapt, overcome.... and in the case of a diving or any other type of emergency, this is exactly what a trained rescue diver will do. You will do whatever is necessary as it becomes necessary and there will be no indecisive moment. I've done rescues, and the bottom line is you just instinctively do what needs to be done. While some of this can be chalked up to training and pre-awareness, my experience tells me that intelligent people with common sense will come to the same conclusions in the same amount of time.
If a diver needed to instantly be out of a rig to effect a rescue, then I doubt I would be fumbling around for buckles, straps etc... no matter what he she was wearing. If I had my shears on me and I felt that was the fastest way... I'd likely cut the straps no matter what type of set up it was. If on the otherhand I quickly identified all release points and had quick access to them, I'd likely release them all. Every emergency situation will be different... no two alike in all aspects, and familiarity with what someone is wearing will be the least of my worries.
Ken
ghostdiver1957
Contributor
pakman:
A note specific for clarification...
I say 1 or 2 out of 20... specific to my region... the northeast US. I've never seen a diver diving this in the Bahamas, Mexico, Central America, Australia etc... Recreational spots. The guys I know in the Northeast US are moving more to this, but the number is still only 1 o2 out of 20.
lee08
Contributor
BP/W is not rocket science in fact it is quite basic. Just like jacket style bc's with a little practice it can be removed quickly and easily in and out of the water.
Around here (Connecticut/RI) more like 60 to 75% in BP/W with more and more non-BP/W back BC's replacing jackets as dry suits become more common.
Not a bad thing.
Spent a lot of time diving Lake Travis when I lived in Austin Texas from 1981 to 2001. Used to marvel at all the people on the surface wearing jackets and too much weight with the shoulders of the jacket level with the top of their heads trying to see past their chest straps.
Not a bad thing.
Spent a lot of time diving Lake Travis when I lived in Austin Texas from 1981 to 2001. Used to marvel at all the people on the surface wearing jackets and too much weight with the shoulders of the jacket level with the top of their heads trying to see past their chest straps.
ghostdiver1957
Contributor
lee08:
I never said it was difficult. Others in the post have said that... but if you read carefully, all I've said is that not many people are using them, so wearing one to training in your rescue class, and being the only one wearing it - and then complaining about it - makes no sense to me.
ghostdiver1957
Contributor
rmannix:
Thanks for the support... It would seem that the farther north you go up the eastern seaboard, the more of them you see. I'm in MD... more mid-atlantic then northeast... but the phenomena is definately spreading southward...
OP
Quoting Bruciebabe:
Very thought-provoking statement. Being the odd man out is clearly in violation of the principle of standardizing gear . . . leaving the diver espousing that philosophy with the choice either to use a gear setup which is not his usual, and which he believes to have disadvantages, or to import a similarly equipped and trained buddy (which is what I have more or less done). Potholes in the road less taken
Very thought-provoking statement. Being the odd man out is clearly in violation of the principle of standardizing gear . . . leaving the diver espousing that philosophy with the choice either to use a gear setup which is not his usual, and which he believes to have disadvantages, or to import a similarly equipped and trained buddy (which is what I have more or less done). Potholes in the road less taken
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