Input needed on sizing of wetsuits, please!

[Mia Toose]

Hello, I had this posted in Women's Perspectives, but with no result, so decided to repost in a different forum. All input welcome!

I am looking for your views regarding sizing for women's wetsuits. As you may know I have designed and developed a line of wetsuits for women called Truli Wetsuits. The concept is that the wetsuits are more true to the women who wear them; they are high-performance, durable, and warm without compromising style. Women have expressed so many times to me that they experience a lot of challenges in finding wetsuits that fit properly, feel good, and at the very least also look good. Truli Wetsuits has definitely improved the situation in many ways for women looking for a wetsuit that meets those criteria.

My first design called the Truli-Mi is a 3.5mm fleece-lined sleeveless shorty and is available for sale in sizes XS, S, M, L, XL (XXL will be available for the next round of inventory coming this year).
During the testing phase I had several different women try the suit and I recorded all of their measurements and clothing sizes, so I could make recommendations when people were buying them online. Here is the sizing chart.

The sizes are working well so far, but I have listened to some people say that they wish that the larger sizes were listed as something other than XL, XXL.

As a woman, do these size descriptions matter to you?

Would something along the lines of XS, S, M, L, L1, L2 make sense to you?

What about renaming the smaller sizes?

Do you have any other suggestions?

I have had experience in the retail industry where a product used a different name for a standard sizing system and it always resulted in some confusion when people were trying items on. I've also seen in wetsuit sizes "ML", which, as dive crew, we were always curious if this meant Medium-Long? or Medium-Large? or Men's-Large? or...And why was it listed like that?

It's important to me that I meet the needs of my customers, so I would really love to hear any and all input from as many people (males included) as possible.

FYI - The Truli-Capri prototype which features the same design as the Truli-Mi, but with a longer leg to just below the knee and no traditional black is being tested this summer. The plan is to have this product available for winter 2016

 

[Dogbowl]

How about 00, 0, 2, 4, 6, 8, 10, 12, 14, 16, etc.? Just a thought...

 

[NAM001]

Ill probably get shunned for this but here goes. Put the vanity for the name away. Judge teh suit for its function and ability to provide that function. I got my wife a shorty a couple of years ago. We went through perhaps 6 different ones on the rack till one fit. For the sake of labeling it was an XXL that got bought cause the XXXL's were to small. I wish manufacturers would get on the same page with he sizing. This goes for mens wear also so you gals are not unique,,, and i fully empathize with you. Face it we all have so many dimensions even assigning size numbers doesn't work. IE (fictiion) Im a size 18 really short with elephant sized legs. Most every thing on the racks are for the ideal model shapes it seams. Definately not for those with reality body's. I cant say that i have met a 5'4 102# female diver that can fit the rack wet suits and still breath.

 

[KeithG]

Hi Mia! Depends upon your desired market: North America or Europe? (or other?). And how many different sizes do you intend to produce / stock?

Us North Americans are all used to the XS, S, M L, XL,,, designations while the Euros are not (I think? I recently had to order a male winter parka from a Scandinavian supplier and was very confused by the numbers - I had to measure myself before I could place my order).

Our NA female world is even more complicated since we use dress sizes for some (much?, most?) female apparel and the S,M,L code for others.

Since your target is female, it likely makes more sense to use "dress size" numeric nomenclature instead of the more masculine S,M,L coding. But only IF you intend to stock that many sizes. You will need to make sure that you size your product for the intended market. Euro dress sizes are not the same as US dress sizes US standard clothing size - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The dress size coding will also allow you to address the young beginner teenager divers.

You should also consider incorporating the concept of "petites" and "tall sizes" (and others?) into your product line. I have spent several lifetimes being dragged through the petites section while attending my divebuddy's shopping expeditions.

Cheers...

 

[Mia Toose]

Ill probably get shunned for this but here goes. Put the vanity for the name away. Judge teh suit for its function and ability to provide that function. I got my wife a shorty a couple of years ago. We went through perhaps 6 different ones on the rack till one fit. For the sake of labeling it was an XXL that got bought cause the XXXL's were to small. I wish manufacturers would get on the same page with he sizing. This goes for mens wear also so you gals are not unique,,, and i fully empathize with you. Face it we all have so many dimensions even assigning size numbers doesn't work. IE (fictiion) Im a size 18 really short with elephant sized legs. Most every thing on the racks are for the ideal model shapes it seams. Definately not for those with reality body's. I cant say that i have met a 5'4 102# female diver that can fit the rack wet suits and still breath.

Thanks so much for this. I don't see a reason to be shunned at all actually. I've heard this story time and time again and I'm interested in figuring out how to end these types of complaints. It's the same way I came up with all the specific features of the wetsuit in the first place. I'm excited that Truli Wetsuits is a high quality wetsuit and flatters all different figures.

I think I had the same view as you, if I understand correctly, which is that the size name doesn't really matter, it's just the fit that counts. Actually, it's the same in clothing sizes as well; for example, in my closet I have everything from Medium - XL and all of them fit me the same regardless of the size name.

However, I am very keen to hear new ideas and people's experiences to see if a new concept can be developed. Keep them coming!

 

[Mia Toose]

Hi Mia! Depends upon your desired market: North America or Europe? (or other?). And how many different sizes do you intend to produce / stock?

Us North Americans are all used to the XS, S, M L, XL,,, designations while the Euros are not (I think? I recently had to order a male winter parka from a Scandinavian supplier and was very confused by the numbers - I had to measure myself before I could place my order).

Our NA female world is even more complicated since we use dress sizes for some (much?, most?) female apparel and the S,M,L code for others.

Since your target is female, it likely makes more sense to use "dress size" numeric nomenclature instead of the more masculine S,M,L coding. But only IF you intend to stock that many sizes. You will need to make sure that you size your product for the intended market. Euro dress sizes are not the same as US dress sizes US standard clothing size - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The dress size coding will also allow you to address the young beginner teenager divers.

You should also consider incorporating the concept of "petites" and "tall sizes" (and others?) into your product line. I have spent several lifetimes being dragged through the petites section while attending my divebuddy's shopping expeditions.

Cheers...

Thanks so much for your input. Did you check out my sizing chart? I was wondering if I should include European dress sizes as well, but figured women who purchase from North America are already familiar with where they stand? I noticed that Fourth Element rash guards do their sizes like: 8-10, 10-12, 12-14, 14-16, 16-18, 18-20. But in our sizing chart, we then categorize them into XS, S, M, L... anyway.
Maybe the number chart is the way to go...
Thinking, thinking, thinking!

 

[NAM001]

One day there will be a maker that makes only custom suits from the start and from the orders determine what the standard ordered cuts are. Even that nay not be doable.

 

[NAM001]

How about 00, 0, 2, 4, 6, 8, 10, 12, 14, 16, etc.? Just a thought...

The problem with that is that a size 8 is x tall and x gut and x everything else. You get a suit that fits your chest and hips and you get a suit that is for someone that is 6 inches taller than you. Get the right heigth and you have a 6" gap in the chest stopping you from zipping up. Three are manufacturers that mold their suits for models and others that mold for short fat divers ect. any one can take their measurements and go to a sizing chart and never never find a suit that will be close to fitting them.

 

[Dizzi Lizzi]

Hello Mia,
Your sizing chart looks good to me. I generally wear an xl, in wetsuits and all the numbers match up (weight and clothing size). I've long stopped caring about if I'm an l, xl or xxl. Now I care about the fit and the look. Vanity sizing is ridiculous. I have several tops that are size medium...and no one would ever say my top is a medium. But when I was younger I certainly was more critical of my self and found myself buying clothing according to the size rather than the fit and look. Good luck with this. What a tightrope you must walk. Since all your suits are short the petite might not matter so much, but I know that given the choice I would always choose a petite xl over an xl since that makes a huge difference in the legs and arms. I assume a tall woman would feel the same. Looking forward to seeing your longer legs suits.

 

[NAM001]

However, I am very keen to hear new ideas and people's experiences to see if a new concept can be developed. Keep them coming!

If you want ideas then the market needs a wet suit that has little buoyncy a cross/blend between a trraditional wet suit and lavacore. take large divers and with the acreage of neo on them they need lots of lead to comp for the suit. would it not be nice if a suit was available that required no more than 5# of lead no matter what size you get. or custom get one with your choice of lift. A suit like this would reduce the lead carried. It would reduce the amount of suit squeeze/compression which once again is tremendous for the larger sizes and thickness. give it a spandex like qauality from the thinner neo used. With the reduced compression smaller wings / BCD's can be used. You get more stablization in your depth control while having he best of both neo and lavacore attributes worlds. You use less air comping the the lift from the lift bladder. And still having a positive lift to stay on the surface. At the start of a dive you have to be able to lift the gear and the compression of the suit at 100 ft. If that compression could be reduced to 5# instead of 25# you can have a smaller wing and its smaller air volumn to expand and constantly adjust for.