Innovation in diving

[gianaameri]

Still just too funny. Please don't worry about making your piss poor decisions. You have already shown to bend / break rules and learn nothing from it. Soon there will be more rules that you will bend / break until one day it bends or breaks you. At this point I give the father and son who died in the cave at EN on Christmas day more credit than I give you. They were ignorant to the strick demands that cave diving commands. You are just stupid because you know better and chose to ignore the rules.

---------- Post added January 13th, 2014 at 12:00 PM ----------



Yes he is and yes he is wrong.

Yes, I broke a Scuba 101 rule, but you have yet to tell me what purpose a Dive Computer/Bottom Timer could have served in a dive where I could not have gone into deco. In my dive:

1. the cave line defined the depth with accuracy, and
2. the time to cover its distance, on or off scooter, with or without mask/visibility could not have resulted in deco requirements.

Heresy, maybe, but why not (exactly) - Tony?

What could have gone wrong that a Dive Computer/Bottom Timer could have made a difference in my dive?

Sent from my GT-I9195 using Tapatalk

---------- Post added January 13th, 2014 at 03:44 PM ----------

Ok, then disoriented and confused or deep in a Zen-like calm… point is that without a timer you cannot state conclusively that your average depth was 12m (and therefore there are situations, albeit unlikely that you could go into deco).

Probably time to move on in this thread, but as I’ve recently moved away from the coast at least it’s had me thinking about what compromises I would be willing to make to my routine in order to dive, particularly if long travel times / high expenses are involved, and what I can do to avoid having to make those decisions.

Make no compromise on Bottom Timer/Dive Computer. Buy and use it.

If you dive Solo in a cave and for whatever reason you are incapacitated to the point that you cannot follow a line out of the cave, you are dead.

It is inherent in the risk of Solo cave diving, with or without Dive Computer/Bottom Timer.

A "buddy" deep in a cave system, in any event, is of limited help (my opinion). Nearer to the entrance instead could be invaluable. Open Water, indispensable.

 

[nimoh]

I basically see one of three things:

1. you don't consider a bottom timer/depth gauge to be proper equipment for the dive you went on
2. you don't actually believe your signature
3. your signature only applies to divers without your vast experience

For me personally, on a 20m dive, I would do 30 second stops at 12m, 9m, 6m and 3m, use my bottom timer and depth gauge to determine those stops, and to gauge my ascent rate. All dives are deco dives, some just require longer deco times.

 

[gianaameri]

I basically see one of three things:

1. you don't consider a bottom timer/depth gauge to be proper equipment for the dive you went on
2. you don't actually believe your signature
3. your signature only applies to divers without your vast experience

For me personally, on a 20m dive, I would do 30 second stops at 12m, 9m, 6m and 3m, use my bottom timer and depth gauge to determine those stops, and to gauge my ascent rate. All dives are deco dives, some just require longer deco times.

It is proper equipment, just not essential to the dive I planned, and the dive was planned precisely taking into account I did not have a Dive Computer/Bottom Timer.

 

[nimoh]

It is proper equipment, just not essential to the dive I planned, and the dive was planned precisely taking into account I did not have a Dive Computer/Bottom Timer.

so it is either 2 or 3, but sounds like you are leaning a bit towards 3

 

[gianaameri]

so it is either 2 or 3, but sounds like you are leaning a bit towards 3

See, you cannot address the key issue, so you waste your time (and mine) with comments which same as the key issue you cannot substantiate.

The key issues, not to repeat myself, is the same Tony cannot address.

As to 2. and 3. of course I believe my signature and it applies to me.

The reason why the Dive Computer/Bottom Timer was not essential in that dive, as explained, is because the dive was planned not to need one (not because I am superman).

1. the cave line defined the depth with accuracy, and
2. the time to cover its distance, on or off scooter, with or without mask/visibility could not have resulted in deco requirements.

 

[nimoh]

See, you cannot address the key issue, so you waste your time (and mine) with comments which same as the key issue you cannot substantiate.

The key issues, not to repeat myself, is the same Tony cannot address.

As to 2. and 3. of course I believe my signature and it applies to me.

The reason why the Dive Computer/Bottom Timer was not essential in that dive, as explained, is because the dive was planned not to need one (not because I am superman).

I have time to waste, but I'm not wasting your time...you are wasting your own.

Perhaps you should change your signature line to read "skill and experience are not an acceptable substitute for essential equipment" since proper equipment seems to be optional on some dives for you.

 

[gianaameri]

I have time to waste, but I'm not wasting your time...you are wasting your own.

Perhaps you should change your signature line to read "skill and experience are not an acceptable substitute for essential equipment" since proper equipment seems to be optional on some dives for you.

It is a matter of semantics.

I like the word "essential" though, and I think you have a good point on this.

"Essential" is more descriptive than "proper."

....having said that maybe "appropriate" is best.

"Just as equipment is not an acceptable substitute for appropriate skill and experience, skill and experience are not an acceptable substitute for appropriate equipment. Plan all diving so that it can be completed safely without the action or inaction of a fellow diver." (DRAFT)

Will give it some thought!

 

[nimoh]

you don't think a bottom timer and depth gauge were appropriate for the dive you did?

 

[gianaameri]

you don't think a bottom timer and depth gauge were appropriate for the dive you did?

It is appropriate to have it, and it is appropriate not to have it.

Take your pick!

 

[nimoh]

well, obviously I think it is appropriate, but you are saying that it is not appropriate. So, if you had remembered it you still wouldn't have taken it?