IANTD vs. ANDI

[DPhantomas]

I am considering doing a Technical Diver course. I am interested in getting information about both organizations' courses, as of comparing levels, limitations, world-known, etc.

Please help me making my decission....

 

[Scubaroo]

Here's a related thread, from another of our Israeli members, so hopefully its relevant.

 

[padiscubapro]

ANDI and IANTD are the oldest tech training agencies around. ANDI enforces stricter gas purity standards and equipment labeling than IANTD. Both agencies have similiar programs, but I feel the ANDI training material is superior. I think its of utmost importance to locate and interview the instructor, and see what type of diving he/she actuall does on a regular basis.. Then decide on the agency if the instructor does both.. ALL ANDI instructors must go through the programs they are to teach ANDI does not do administrative crossovers.

ANDI doesn't allow independent instructors all training must be done through an ANDI facility, also ANDI routinely checks up on all tech instructors... EVERY student who completes any tech program (Level 3 and Above) receives a detailed questionaire to fill out.. This way an instructor who likes to short cut will get caught and thrown out.. To this date ANDI has never had an Insurance claim(including training programs to 100m).. thats 14 years straight, no other agency can claim that... The best I have heard is 4 years in a row..

There have been some well know tech instructors that have been thrown out of ANDI because of the questionaires (including an IT )..
A point of info Tom M. of IANTD and Brett G of TDI were both at one time ANDI instructors, with T.M being an IT. (they left the agency to head IANTD).
There are a great many well know inductry people that have been part of ANDI at one time or another...

 

[detroit diver]

Are there any GUE instructors in Israel? I would jump on that one if it's available.

 

[DPhantomas]

Thank you very much for your replies, they helped me a lot.

I don't know any GUE in Israel right now, but I'll check for that.

 

[ericfine50]

ANDI - a great tech organization?? Are you serious. I would not trust Ed Betts at all.

Eric

 

[padiscubapro]

Ed has been around a long time and a very knowledgeable person. He doesn't believe in cutting any corners and over the years hasn't pleased everyone.. I can tell you one thing he speaks his mind, I have never known him to say one thing and do something else, with him you know where he stands and you stand.. I live and dive around Long Island so I have known of him (at least 10 years) before I decided to do some training with him, and he has always been up front about everything.. He hasn't always been a favovite of local dive shop owners (and thats probably the reason for the lack of local facilities) I think because he was always an agressive businessman.. I think he has mellowed out in the years since he gave up his dive shops and decided to concentrate on ANDI.. You may not like him personally but if you haven't taken one of his classes you realy shouldn't speak, his programs and training materials are all top notch.. His training manuals contain significantly more material than any other program (show me ANY nitrox manual that even comes close to CSU and I'll shut up..) I have seen especially some of his instructor manuals.

 

[Diversauras]

I did NITROX through ANDI at Marina Divers in Elait. I think they (used to) also teach other tech courses. I don't know if they are still doing it since I've been out of there more than three years now but here is some info:

Marina Divers
P.O. Box 599
Coral Beach, South Marina
Eilat, 88000 Israel
Phone: (972) 7-6376787
Fax: (972) 7-637313

Hope it helps. I also think they are linked to Dolphin Reef, this is their site:

http://www.dolphinreef.co.il/activities/dive_packages/dive_packages.html

 

[Lost Yooper]

Since this Mr. Betts is apparently honest and upfront, does he let his students in on the fact that deep air diving is physiologically dangerous? Does he tell all of his students that divers can't learn to deal with narcosis? Does he hand out the numorous studies that prove this to be true? I don't know the man, but I do know that ANDI gives instructors the option to take students to 190'. It doesn't appear as ANDI has the best interest of their students in mind to me (IANTD as well).

Just curious how honest this guy really is?

Mike

 

[padiscubapro]

LY,
How many times do I have to answer this question the same way.. That has been out a long time.. The web site is out of date.. In truth that option was on the request of a specific IT (it was allowed in the early 90s before Trimix was a viable option) and required ideal conditions..
The training limit is 165 for non helium mixes - end of story!


He preaches nitrogen narcosis is bad and that you really can't be sure of your level of narcosis - even though you may FEEL fine you are impared and has shown chamber studies showing so.... All diving below 165 is Helium only and should be considered below 130 especially in overhead enviroments..


All the current the TSD (and other level 3 classes),and ext range diver (level 4) classes list 165/50m and a PN2 of 4.5 as the limit no exceptions.. I should know I made all the cert card layouts for him..

as for a diver not doing deeper than 130 on air.. I'l like to see you fly all the way to a place like Truk (warm water, no current great viz) and not do anything deeper than 130 because its nearly impossible to get He without lots of advanced planning and $$$ (about $750 for a K cylinder plus return shipping to cylinder to Guam) and a bit of luck(that it actually gets there when needed). I certainly want to dive a He mix but if it isn't available I'm certainly not going to not dive especially since many years ago these depths were routine.
I was just there with my CCR and at deeper than 170 the PN2 is greater than that of a person diving Air(I use a Po2 of 1.3)... If I limited myself to 130 I would have missed some of the best dives truk has to offer.. I looked over my computer logs and I had 25 dives at 160 or deeper.