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I got a couple tanks (both HP and MP) filled an an LDS today just to find out (again :sadlike
that they were 300psi underfilled. And we are talking room temperature here (75 deg), not even cold water. My gauges are quite accurate - I have both an analog and digital gauge on my reg, and they agree. My gauges agree with most other people's gauges on dives too.
It has been my experience with a number of local dive shops that the fill station ops routinely underfill customer tanks. While it gets annoying over time (for most divers) to get constant underfills, people don't say anything in the dive shop for the sake of keeping the sail in smooth waters. :ignore:
If you somehow decide to protest the underfills by asking politely for a "good" fill, you will likely get back one of these:
Granted, it's so much easier for the fill guys to give you a bad fill than a good one. With a bad fill, they can get you out the door faster, stretch their banked air supply, and avoid feeling guilty about filling your tank around or over the rated pressure (to compensate for cooling). And also, there is this percieved increase in their own safety, when they keep the pressure below the max with customer tanks. :devil_2:
This problem seems to be more common around here than in the tropics. In fact 95% of the time I get correctly filled or even overfilled (100-200psi) tanks when on vacation (when in the water, NOT when in the car trunk). For one thing, most of the tanks in the Caribbean are rentals and the stores tend to put higher trust their own tanks (?). Conversely, most of the tanks in New England are privately owned, and thus less trustworthy (in the eyes of fill station ops).
I used to fill people's tanks a few years back at an LDS (I haven't worked at a dive shop for years). Those days, I almost always went the extra mile to give the customers "good" fills, even if the hair in the back of my neck stood up when presented with a beaten up tank. :angel_2:
I even know for a fact that most fill station ops put a few extra psi in their own tanks (sometimes it's scary how much they overfill their tanks) without any guilt. While I wouldn't expect the same threatment as a customer, I do expect to get a my tanks filled to their rated pressure at room temp (a "good" fill). In reality, I've only gotten a "good" fills as a special favour from a guy I know!
On a separate note, most of my bad fill experience has been with LDSes which give "dry" fills (which is mostly all of them). I've had better experience with "wet" fill stores. Of course, there is this ongoing debate about wet vs dry fills, which I don't want to get into. This aside, if you ask me, the fill ops at these stores feel more daring to open the valve when the tank is partially submerged or perhaps the store tries to make a statement that they care about giving you a good fill (by cooling your tank) - I don't know...
I know that these fill-related topics have probably been beaten up countless number of times in other threads, but I still would like to hear what the lobstah divas have to say about their local experience with LDSes and fills.
I'd like to know:
- Are people getting bad fills like me around, or is it just my own bad luck / faulty gauges? Which store do you use?
- Are you annoyed by the routine 200-300 psi underfill, which translates to 400-500psi underfill once you hop in the water or you don't care much at all?
- Is it fair to expect good fills from a reputable dive store or are the undefills acceptable around here?
- What can one do about it, without alienating the store staff? Wear "3000psi or bust" t-shirt? Tip the fill station op? :god:
that they were 300psi underfilled. And we are talking room temperature here (75 deg), not even cold water. My gauges are quite accurate - I have both an analog and digital gauge on my reg, and they agree. My gauges agree with most other people's gauges on dives too.It has been my experience with a number of local dive shops that the fill station ops routinely underfill customer tanks. While it gets annoying over time (for most divers) to get constant underfills, people don't say anything in the dive shop for the sake of keeping the sail in smooth waters. :ignore:
If you somehow decide to protest the underfills by asking politely for a "good" fill, you will likely get back one of these:
- A lecture on tank fill safety and how one should always err on the conservative side.
- A lecture that a few hundred PSI no difference make.
- A lame excuse about the fill station gauges being off
- A suggestion that you should improve your breating rate, practice buoyancy, and enroll in a buoyancy course
- A suggestion that you bring your tanks back later (at your own time expense) to get them topped off.
- A denial of your tanks being undefilled (after all, you are probably not carrying a tank gauge with you). :54:
Granted, it's so much easier for the fill guys to give you a bad fill than a good one. With a bad fill, they can get you out the door faster, stretch their banked air supply, and avoid feeling guilty about filling your tank around or over the rated pressure (to compensate for cooling). And also, there is this percieved increase in their own safety, when they keep the pressure below the max with customer tanks. :devil_2:
This problem seems to be more common around here than in the tropics. In fact 95% of the time I get correctly filled or even overfilled (100-200psi) tanks when on vacation (when in the water, NOT when in the car trunk). For one thing, most of the tanks in the Caribbean are rentals and the stores tend to put higher trust their own tanks (?). Conversely, most of the tanks in New England are privately owned, and thus less trustworthy (in the eyes of fill station ops).
I used to fill people's tanks a few years back at an LDS (I haven't worked at a dive shop for years). Those days, I almost always went the extra mile to give the customers "good" fills, even if the hair in the back of my neck stood up when presented with a beaten up tank. :angel_2:
I even know for a fact that most fill station ops put a few extra psi in their own tanks (sometimes it's scary how much they overfill their tanks) without any guilt. While I wouldn't expect the same threatment as a customer, I do expect to get a my tanks filled to their rated pressure at room temp (a "good" fill). In reality, I've only gotten a "good" fills as a special favour from a guy I know!
On a separate note, most of my bad fill experience has been with LDSes which give "dry" fills (which is mostly all of them). I've had better experience with "wet" fill stores. Of course, there is this ongoing debate about wet vs dry fills, which I don't want to get into. This aside, if you ask me, the fill ops at these stores feel more daring to open the valve when the tank is partially submerged or perhaps the store tries to make a statement that they care about giving you a good fill (by cooling your tank) - I don't know...
I know that these fill-related topics have probably been beaten up countless number of times in other threads, but I still would like to hear what the lobstah divas have to say about their local experience with LDSes and fills.
I'd like to know:
- Are people getting bad fills like me around, or is it just my own bad luck / faulty gauges? Which store do you use?
- Are you annoyed by the routine 200-300 psi underfill, which translates to 400-500psi underfill once you hop in the water or you don't care much at all?
- Is it fair to expect good fills from a reputable dive store or are the undefills acceptable around here?
- What can one do about it, without alienating the store staff? Wear "3000psi or bust" t-shirt? Tip the fill station op? :god:
