How many non-tech divers carry a pony bottle?

[CoyKoi]

I'm not a tech diver and although I have a lot of respect for these folks, I have no interest in joining their ranks.

I carry a 19cu ft pony with 32EAN on deep dives (100' - 130'). I clip it to my BCD under my right arm. I'm very vigilant about my gas management and don't factor my pony's gas into my gas management plan. I think of it only as an insurance policy in case something goes horribly wrong with my primary gas supply, or my buddy encounters a problem with his/her gas supply at that depth. For me, knowing I have this "insurance policy" helps to reduce some of the stress associated with diving that deep. And besides, you can never have too much air at 100' anyway. I'm not large enough to comfortably carry a bigger pony or strong enough to pack doubles, so this seems the logical way to go.

I also carry the pony with me when I'm assisting with the deep dives for an AOW class. I let the students practice deploying it and breathing with it on our safety stop. The only down side to carrying a pony is that getting my bouyancy just right can sometimes be a challenge.

 

[Diver0001]

Tech divers do not use pony bottles.
They may use a stage bottle (to extend bottom time) or a deco bottle (to accelerate deco). But they don't carry pony bottles (which are used for bail out).

You know.....

Starting today, I'm going to start calling the things on my feet "flippers", the thing on my face "goggles", my BCD a "life vest", the thing around my neck an "octopus" and stages a "pony" just to make a point.

You make a nice attempt at a definition but do you know the real difference between a stage and pony? ..... application.

If you plan your gas and you know what you're going to need out of your "pony" and when, then you call it a "stage". If you don't plan your gas and you're not sure what you need out of your "pony" then you call it a "pony".

In other words "pony" means "brain in neutral" and "stage" means "brain engaged".

This distinction has not escaped many an internet diver who calls his pony a stage or "slings" his pony so he/she sounds like they know what they're doing....or so they sound cool. It doesn't change the facts, only the terminology.

Next year, we'll start calling a "stage" a "mix bottle" and the word "stage" will mean you're an idiot....at least on the internet.

If we dig into the question the OP is asking, then what he's really asking is "should I think about way to improve my configuration" and the answer to that is always a resounding YES.

I don't care what he calls it but the important part is that he's asking.

R..

 

[JungleJoe]

I have a 30cu pony, it's on a sling I can clip it on my bcd, I take it only when it's "needed".. for me that is, if I am diving with someone else that either I don't know well, or we're doing a dive that will push the limits abit., always nice to have a backup., if I am diving in a haz enviro, like ice diving or wreck/deep I usually take it along. If I am just going to the quarry or local lake for a spin by myself, I usually don't bother taking it under w/me.

 

[MissyP]

I carry a 19cu ft pony with 32EAN on deep dives (100' - 130'). I clip it to my BCD under my right arm. I'm very vigilant about my gas management and don't factor my pony's gas into my gas management plan. I think of it only as an insurance policy in case something goes horribly wrong with my primary gas supply, or my buddy encounters a problem with his/her gas supply at that depth. For me, knowing I have this "insurance policy" helps to reduce some of the stress associated with diving that deep. And besides, you can never have too much air at 100' anyway.

The only down side to carrying a pony is that getting my bouyancy just right can sometimes be a challenge.

My thoughts exactly- except that I don't use my pony unless the dive is past 115'-120'. I never factor it (or my buddy's pony) in as part of my (or their) air supply.. Even though my dives are planned carefully, there is always the chance of something unexpected happening to me or my buddy.

I've never had problems with a buoyancy change with the pony- but I have mine strapped to my bp/w instead of slinging it...

 

[ClayJar]

I carry a 19cu ft pony with 32EAN on deep dives (100' - 130').

This intrigues me. Do you mind if I ask why you chose EAN32 for your pony?

I assume you chose EAN32 because you get 1.6 atm ppO₂ at 132' (1.6 atm is, if nothing else, what NAUI's basic nitrox book recommends as a contingency limit while recommending 1.4 atm for general recreational purposes).

Shall I assume that you chose to go with EAN to increase the rate of nitrogen offgassing on a bailout in order to give yourself just a bit more potential cushion between you and the bends?

I have air in my pony, but considering that it does not have enough volume to be of much use below common "recreational limits" (i.e. c. 130fsw), it would be interesting to ponder alternate fills. Would the increased potential for oxtox overwhelm the potential offgassing benefit of an alternate mix? On a 19cf pony, if I'm bailing (due to gear failure, of course, as I wouldn't run out of gas otherwise) from depths at which DCS is a prime concern, would I have enough gas in the bottle to make the difference between air and EAN32 (or whatever) of much use? (I guess I really need to get some deco software to model this.)

 

[Meng_Tze]

I have air in my pony, but considering that it does not have enough volume to be of much use below common "recreational limits" (i.e. c. 130fsw), it would be interesting to ponder alternate fills. Would the increased potential for oxtox overwhelm the potential offgassing benefit of an alternate mix? On a 19cf pony, if I'm bailing (due to gear failure, of course, as I wouldn't run out of gas otherwise) from depths at which DCS is a prime concern, would I have enough gas in the bottle to make the difference between air and EAN32 (or whatever) of much use? (I guess I really need to get some deco software to model this.)

Actually you do raise a point I was waiting for. Two previous posters mention that they do not include the pony in their gas plan. I think it should be included. If you know what you have as a 'bail out' you can decide to plan the dive differently. I for one would want to know how much gas I need to get both myself and my buddy sharing that gas to the surface in the worst case scenario. The Po2 is not an issue in terms of how much gas you need, of course it does count when we are talking about higher levels and the risks that come with that (Oxtox, Narcosis etc). But better to be bent than to drown...

 

[RJP]

I sling a 40cf bottle when in the ocean.

 

[KMD]

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If you rely on the pony bottle, you may forget about proper gas management and planning, and the pony bottle may not be enough for you or your buddy to return to the surface from a deep dive (100 ft and deeper) when you will have to ascend slowly to provent any risk of decompression sickness. You can find a lot about proper gas management online, one of the most conservative ones, is to have 2/3 of your gas supply as the point of return, which means you will start your way back to the surface. It is one of the most conservative and is not always necessary, but it will ensure that both yourself and your buddy will have enough air supply to safely return to the surface, without any rush, as any kind of nervousness will increase your gas consumption, and I am sure you understand what that may imply in the worst case scenario. Be safe. Enjoy diving. Make sure to plan it properly. If you have any questions, don't hesitate to ask.

Not to be too nit-pickey here, but the rule of 3rds is not always the most conservative gas management strategys and can in certain situations get you in trouble. A good example would be a dive to 100' on an AL80. Reserving 1/3 for emergency could lead you into trouble.

 

[Meng_Tze]

8

.. A good example would be a dive to 100' on an AL80. Reserving 1/3 for emergency could lead you into trouble....

Not sure I follow... how would that get you in trouble? It just means you have less to burn at depth and therefore your time is shorter?

 

[marusso]

It is possible that there is not enough gas in an AL80 when calculating the rock bottom when you are at 100' going by the rule of thirds rule with a stressful OOA situation if it should occur towards the end of the dive.