How Is Puget Sound Diving In The Winter?

[TSandM]

Well, the visibility tends to be better in the winter, except after heavy rains. But a lot of the life is missing. I don't know where the fish go, but they go somewhere I'm not, and all the pretty kelp are missing. It makes the nudibranchs easier to find, though . . .

 

[Coldwater_Canuck]

I read an article years ago by a diving doctor that said that external heating devices (thermal pads and hot water) actually sped up heat loss from your core. The temporary, localized heat from jugs of hot water ...

I thought the whole point of the jugs of water wasn't to heat up your body directly, but to increase the warmth of the layer of water in the wetsuit? That localized heating theory could very well be correct, but the warm water would still help because it would improve the insulation properties of the wet suit.

I found that by far the best way to stay reasonably warm was to use a wetsuit jacket with an attached hood that prevented water from gushing down the back of my neck. These used to be common decades ago, but they're almost nonexistent now. Maybe the manufacturers want you to be cold enough to upgrade to one of their drysuits. When I found one of these old wetsuits at a thrift store or garage sale, I'd grab it up quick. My favorite was a thin (around 5mm) vest with attached hood. I'd wear my wetsuit jacket over that and then I'd wear a normal-thickness large hood over the thin hood. Of course 5-finger gloves were out. I still only wear 3-finger mits.

All the suits I've used had an attached hood. Both places I rented from (Underwater Sports and Lighthouse Diving) give the 7mm Farmer John I think they're called (so you have 14mm over your core) and the hoods are attached to the jacket.

 

[MarkH]

I thought the whole point of the jugs of water wasn't to heat up your body directly, but to increase the warmth of the layer of water in the wetsuit? That localized heating theory could very well be correct, but the warm water would still help because it would improve the insulation properties of the wet suit.

Yeah, I guess if water's going to be getting in there anyway, it might as well be warm water. It makes sense to me. Maybe his point was that it's fine to dump hot water down your neck before the first dive when you're already warm, but when you're cold at the end of the dive and your body is trying to keep your blood in your core, dumping hot water in your suit might counteract this defensive condition and make your body send your warm blood back out to your cold extremities. -Sort of like in the 1800's when they'd rub a hypothermia victim's arms and legs to "restore circulation" or whatever it was. This ended up killing alot of people. -Same with giving them hot drinks.

All the suits I've used had an attached hood. Both places I rented from (Underwater Sports and Lighthouse Diving) give the 7mm Farmer John I think they're called (so you have 14mm over your core) and the hoods are attached to the jacket.

Wow. I thought those things were extinct. I'm glad to see some places still think they're a good idea. Up here, all I see for rentals (and most sales) are the 7mm farmer johns and the seperate "wetsuit hood" with the big bib in the back.

 

[TSandM]

Same with giving them hot drinks

Actually, hot drinks are a GOOD idea -- that's core warming. What's NOT a good idea in somebody suffering from hypothermia is to heat the skin, because the vasoconstriction of the skin that occurs with chilling actually reduces heat loss. When we have severe hypothermia patients in the ER, we heat the air they breathe, lavage their stomachs with hot water, and lavage their bladders with hot water, because those are good ways to transfer heat to the core.

What's not a good idea is hot ALCOHOLIC drinks, because alcohol defeats the vasoconstriction, and also increases fluid losses.

 

[MarkH]

Actually, hot drinks are a GOOD idea -- that's core warming. What's NOT a good idea in somebody suffering from hypothermia is to heat the skin, because the vasoconstriction of the skin that occurs with chilling actually reduces heat loss. When we have severe hypothermia patients in the ER, we heat the air they breathe, lavage their stomachs with hot water, and lavage their bladders with hot water, because those are good ways to transfer heat to the core.

What's not a good idea is hot ALCOHOLIC drinks, because alcohol defeats the vasoconstriction, and also increases fluid losses.

In first aid training up here, they teach NOT to give hot drinks because they say it tricks the body into thinking that it's warm and then it sends blood out to the very cold extremities where it loses it's heat and this (now cold) blood returns to the core and cools it down (causing organ failure). They tell us that the body has to be warmed up from the outside only. I guess this is probably just first aid for when you're out in the wilderness and in an ER, the body has probably already warmed up abit from being in an ambulance and a warm hospital.

 

[Dean810]

In first aid training up here, they teach NOT to give hot drinks because they say it tricks the body into thinking that it's warm and then it sends blood out to the very cold extremities where it loses it's heat and this (now cold) blood returns to the core and cools it down (causing organ failure). They tell us that the body has to be warmed up from the outside only. I guess this is probably just first aid for when you're out in the wilderness and in an ER, the body has probably already warmed up abit from being in an ambulance and a warm hospital.

Now I'm so confused!

 

[MarkH]

I did a quick web search on first aid for hypothermia to see if I was just crazy and about 1/2 of the results said to give hot drinks and 1/2 said that hot drinks were dangerous (as I was taught). I remember about 10 years ago, we were taught to give hot drinks, but now they changed it, saying it could kill a severely hypothermic victim. Of course if it's just mild hypothermia, give 'em whatever they want (except ice cream).

 

[TSandM]

Hot drinks taken internally are not going to cause peripheral vasodilation UNTIL the core is warm. On the other hand, local topical warming CAN cause peripheral vasodilation, allowing warmer core blood to perfuse relatively cool peripheral sites.

The best warming is internal warming, combined with insulating the periphery as well as possible.

 

[BigFame]

Hot drinks taken internally are not going to cause peripheral vasodilation UNTIL the core is warm. On the other hand, local topical warming CAN cause peripheral vasodilation, allowing warmer core blood to perfuse relatively cool peripheral sites.

The best warming is internal warming, combined with insulating the periphery as well as possible.

I was going to suggest hugs.

I am a big guy and tend to be minimly effected by the temp, although it is what 28 degrees today? I can't imagine going for a dive right now. I dive a wet suit and it is not the dive that freaks me out today, it is the part where I have to get out.

I got one of those monster Gatorade keg things I fill with hot water on dive days, thing is wonderful and they sell them at my work. WOHOOOOOOO!!!!


By the way my wet suit is a one piece 7mm, I can't even imagine how a 7mm farmer john would feel with 14mm over the core.

 

[misslissa42]

I just did a trip with a few buddies up to Mikes in the Pugeot Sound last month. I am completely addicted to my drysuit, (logged exactly four PNW dives in the wetsuit) but two of the other divers survived a three day weekend in wet suits just fine.

Most important part was making sure to get nice and warm between dives. As mentioned, the water up there isn't that much colder in the winter than the rest of the year, but it can be a challenge to warm back up on the surface. If ya have the option, make a weekend trip out of it to one of the little "dive resorts" along the canal and take advantage of those hot showers to fill your wetsuit up before you suit up.

And the 20+ ft of vis along with major octopus sitings made it pretty worthwhile.