How do you deal with derision?

[Leejnd]

I'm a new DIR diver (not a new diver, just new to DIR - I did my Fundies recently, still provisional and trying to get a pass). I'm still in the process of dialing in my gear - before the class I switched from a bc to a bp/w, changed out my hoses, etc. Last week I bought a can light, and learned how to use it on dives over the weekend. Now I just picked up a couple DIR-compliant back-up lights, and need to attach them to my rig.

So today I stopped by a local dive op - the only dive op in my area that pumps Nitrox, as it turns out - to pick up a couple of bolt snaps. I only saw brass ones, so I asked the owner if he had stainless. He urged me to buy the brass ones instead, because "they'll last way longer than stainless". I told him I really needed stainless, and he seemed confused by that, until I said "well, I need them for the GUE class I'm taking", thinking that would explain it well enough and he could just give me a straight answer as to whether or not he has them.

He rolled his eyes and said, "Oh yeah, those guys. Yup, you'll HAVE to use stainless. Sorry, you won't find much in here for what you're doing." And then he turned his back on me and seemed no longer the least bit interested in offering me any service at all. I was a bit stunned - I mean, am I not welcome in his shop because I happen to take GUE classes? The bummer is that he's the only place I can get Nitrox fills, and frankly I'm not too interested in giving him my business after that kind of treatment.

This is not the first time this has happened. When I was in Costa Rica recently, we did five days of boat dives, and several other divers on the boat were very curious about our bp/w rigs, having apparently never seen anything like it before. Which was fine - we were happy to answer questions about it - until the guys who saw our Halcyon gear and asked me if we're cave divers. When I said no, they made some derisive comments about "fake tech divers" (and then they started talking in their own language, I think it was Dutch, and seemed to have a few more choice things to say about us among themselves.)

I also recently was at a dive event and mentioned my Fundies class, and several divers whom I know and respect made similar derisive comments...things like "oh those guys are dive nazi's" and "why bother taking tech training if you're just doing recreational dives?" You know the drill.

Then, of course, there was the recent, infamous "Fundies kicked my ass" thread, which surprised me with the anti-DIR vehemence of a certain poster in that thread (until he weirdly went all soft and started talking about food and wine - what was up with THAT? :w-t-f.

Now, I'm well aware that there have been conflicts between the DIR and non-DIR diving communities for years, many stretching back to disagreements and incidents that happened way back when, with people like GI III and others. I don't know the whole history - not really interested - but I know enough to know there IS a history.

My question is, what do you say when people act like that? I'm not really sure what I'm asking for - I certainly don't expect to be able to change closed minds all by my lonesome, and I'm not interested in proselytizing - but a couple of choice phrases might work (which might make me feel a little better than just slinking away!). I'm sure many of you dive mainly with other GUE/UTD trained divers - but I will continue to do more dives without DIR divers than with, just cuz that's who I know. I also do a lot of dive travel (I'm heading for Cozumel next week) and, if my experience in Costa Rica is any indication, I can expect to continue to have encounters like this.

I'm just curious what y'all say and do when you run into this type of reaction.

 

[ucfdiver]

I would suggest not bringing up GUE at all. Simply state that you're taking a course where your instructor has requested stainless snaps and you'd like to stick with what he/she has requested until you verify anything else is OK. At this point you can walk out and find another source, respectfully.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Then, of course, there was the recent, infamous "Fundies kicked my ass" thread, which surprised me with the anti-DIR vehemence of a certain poster in that thread (until he weirdly went all soft and started talking about food and wine - what was up with THAT? :w-t-f.

... he went to Cozumel and was drinking a lot ... mellowed him out a bit, I think ...

Now, I'm well aware that there have been conflicts between the DIR and non-DIR diving communities for years, many stretching back to disagreements and incidents that happened way back when, with people like GI III and others. I don't know the whole history - not really interested - but I know enough to know there IS a history.

My question is, what do you say when people act like that?

Absolutely nothing ... you're never going to change those people's way of thinking. So why bother? Their response says more about them than it does about you. Just go about your business, have fun, and be a good role model for others ... that's about the most constructive way to deal with it.

I'm not really sure what I'm asking for - I certainly don't expect to be able to change closed minds all by my lonesome, and I'm not interested in proselytizing - but a couple of choice phrases might work (which might make me feel a little better than just slinking away!). I'm sure many of you dive mainly with other GUE/UTD trained divers - but I will continue to do more dives without DIR divers than with, just cuz that's who I know. I also do a lot of dive travel (I'm heading for Cozumel next week) and, if my experience in Costa Rica is any indication, I can expect to continue to have encounters like this.

I'm just curious what y'all say and do when you run into this type of reaction.

Well now ... sometimes it can turn out kinda fun. Three years ago when I went to Lembeh Straits (Indonesia), the resort manager was standing there when they offloaded my gear and started putting it on the boat. Noticing my BP/W she asked me if I knew Lynne ...

... of course I do. But keep in mind that this manager didn't even know we were from the same part of the USA ... much less that we'd actually know each other. It was just the first time since Lynne and Peter had been there almost a year and a half earlier that she'd seen a backplate.

Can't wait to see some of the reaction I get when I start showing up at these vacation places with a sidemount rig ... :shocked2:

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[fisheater]

Best I can tell, I was the only backplatin', long hosin' diver on Kauai during my trip there. No derision, either from vacation divers, DMs or the shop owner. I got a few questions from other divers and a few DMs said - under their breath - that they'd like to dive a BP/W, too, but were limited to what the shop sells.

Also, Lowes has marine grade snap bolts (and for a lot less than any dive shop).


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[noreastDIVER84]

I am going to start off right away by saying that I am not a DIR diver. I have adopted some of the concepts, as a result of the training I started off with. I am not for or against GUE in general, but when I get people telling me that because of my configuration I am a hazard to them and others. I am not a "team" diver for most of the dives I do, I am not going to get into why I chose to dive this way. and I don't want to hear why I shouldn't either. I have a few regular dive buddies and we have a standing dive plan, but we do go over that at the beginning of the dive as well.

I don't trash talk any method of diving or diver in particular, but if they want to preach their method of diving to me I will come back with why I don't agree with a certain concept.

 

[Rainer]

I'd double check those Lowes snaps. I picked up a few several years ago, but the springs weren't SS. They rusted pretty quickly. I had good luck with the Nix snaps, but he seems to be carrying fewer and fewer sizes. These days, I'll usually just tack a few on to an order from Piranha.

As for derision, I usually don't see much of it. I go about my own diving and let others go about theirs.

 

[noreastDIVER84]

Well I will be showing up in Bonaire in a few days with a sidemount rig. I am sure I will be getting some strange looks and questions as I am gearing up.

 

[Leejnd]

As for derision, I usually don't see much of it. I go about my own diving and let others go about theirs.

That's pretty much how I feel - like I said, I have no interest in proselytizing or changing anybody's mind or spreading any word. I just wanna dive. If someone asks me about my gear or practices, and is genuinely interested, I'll be happy to answer questions, to the best of my abilities. But in the situations that I described above, I hadn't sought out anyone's opinion or derision...it just landed in my lap and caught me by surprise. I can't be the only DIR diver this has happened to - especially since it's happened to me several times in such a short period of time. I can't think of anything I'm doing to invite this type of response - all I did was ask for bolt snaps, or mention that I recently took some training...and I'm rather puzzled by the suggestion that I not even mention GUE. Why? Is it something to be hidden and not talked about?

I would never dream of criticizing or being derisive towards someone else's choice in gear, dive philosophy, or preferences (unless, of course, I thought someone was being so unsafe as to be potentially deadly...and even then I'd probably seek out someone else to bring it to their attention, such as the DM or boat captain or dive op employee). So I've been surprised at the comments I've received, and was wondering what others have said/done.

 

[ucfdiver]

I am going to start off right away by saying that I am not a DIR diver. I have adopted some of the concepts, as a result of the training I started off with. I am not for or against GUE in general, but when I get people telling me that because of my configuration I am a hazard to them and others. I am not a "team" diver for most of the dives I do, I am not going to get into why I chose to dive this way. [I]and I don't want to hear why I shouldn't either.[/I] I have a few regular dive buddies and we have a standing dive plan, but we do go over that at the beginning of the dive as well.

I don't trash talk any method of diving or diver in particular, but if they want to preach their method of diving to me I will come back with why I don't agree with a certain concept.

Well I will be showing up in Bonaire in a few days with a sidemount rig. I am sure I will be getting some strange looks and questions as I am gearing up.

Do you think that maybe...just maybe the DIR forum isn't the best place for your feedback?

 

[ligersandtions]

I've gotten comments about being "one of those" divers....and usually I just laugh it off and promise the person that I won't preach to them. I try to keep it light. As for people online, I just ignore it (after a couple pages of the "Fundies kicked my ass" thread, I never bothered opening it again).

Most of the time, though, people don't say anything until after they see the way my buddy(s) and I dive....and then they're often curious.

When we were in Cozumel, we got no questions about the bp/w's, almost no questions/comments about how we dive (one lady did mention that she liked watching us with our lights....and said we looked like something from outer space or something )....but we got zillions of questions about why we were diving drysuits.

Some people have a negative connotation about GUE/DIR. If they're at all open to a conversation, I'm happy to discuss....if they're very close-minded about it, I keep it light and steer the conversation away from that topic. I'm very non-confrontational -- I deal with it by ignoring it.