Hog Regulator Combo or get something better ???

[Paladin]

Only the EDGE EXP has a plastic barrel in the second stage, at $240 MAP it is an AMAZING bargain. The EXP is competing at a price point below many unbalanced first stages (the EXP is a balanced diaphragm) and unbalanced/unadjustable second stages (the EXP is balanced adjustable) The EDGE EPIC 2012 ($320 non cold, $250 cold version MAP) has a Brass/Chrome barrel in the second stage and the EDGE TiExtreme ($699 MAP)has a Titanium barrel.

If you really dislike the plastic barrel, tell any EDGE dealer you want to upgrade to a EPIC 212 for the difference in price and that I told them to send me back the old EXP. I'll make it work for all involved.

My oldest son has an Edge Epic that I bought him for last Christmas. He loves it and says he has no intention of switching brands. I've dived it and I agree that it is a fantastic regulator. I am pleased with the rugged simplicity of the first stage. There really isn't much difference between the Conshelf/Titan first stage and the Edge/HOG. The Edge has two or three fewer parts, which just makes it simpler to service. The second stage, however, is more complex. If I were just starting out, Edge would be my choice. However, I prefer all-metal second stages. A plastic second stage with a metal barrel isn't enough. Plastic seconds are fine as octos, though. This is why I've been collecting Conshelf/Aquarius/Calypso regulators. I don't need adjustable/balanced second stages. Properly tuned, a Conshelf gives me all the air I need without the added complexity. I like things simple. I like the "set-it-and-forget-it philosophy. I tune the second the way I want it and leave it. But that's just me. My favorite Conshelf is my beloved Conshelf 14. It was one of the last ones made a few years ago. I got it military surlpus, NIB.

My youngest son won't even consider trading his Aqua-Lung Calypso.

To my way of thinking, an Edge or HOG first stage paired with a Conshelf all-metal second would be an ideal combination. Now, if Edge/HOG should ever come out with an all-metal second, I would start to drool.

I appreciate the offer but, for now, my Conshelfs fill my needs perfectly.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pC-4DYwWmgg

 

[ams511]

Scubapro always claimed they were the best because the company had a very aggressive campaign for years to hold up such a claim and they did a very good job at protecting this fantasy. Make it impossible for people to get parts, charge an arm and a leg then claim you get what you pay for, and make it mandatory to bring it in every year for free parts. What a perfect scam.

Then the internet comes along and totally demystifies everything about regs because information flows freely like vodka in Russia.
Thanks to pros like DA Aquamaster, Halocline, Awap, and a bunch of others, they have really helped to demystify the whole SP mystique and expose it for what it really is, a lot of really overpriced gear no better than anything else. Prior to the internet dealers had some sort of secret code and they were very tight lipped about all aspects of the workings of Scubapro.
Some of them still try to keep secretive and it's hilarious. I feel like telling them, hey man you can stop now with the games the cat's out of the bag.

Don't forget brother Zung, he has photo and link for any question you might have.

 

[Skippy4]

Ok. So if money wasn't an issue and a u could get any reg for free; what would be ur top choice?

No need to consider a reg to be a great choice or a top contender because of the price.

Reliability, durability, features, warranty, how it breathes, weight

I did a lot of research before I purchased my SG-1000. I wish I could have afforded the Scubapro MK17/A700. My friends in my dive club use the MK17/A700 and love it for it's reliability, and the ease of breathing. I have tried it myself, and really wish I could have afforded to buy it for myself. The MK17/A700 would be my regulator of choice.

 

[Paladin]

Ok. So if money wasn't an issue and a u could get any reg for free; what would be ur top choice?

No need to consider a reg to be a great choice or a top contender because of the price.

Reliability, durability, features, warranty, how it breathes, weight

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Conshelf. No question. If not a Conshelf, then an Edge. I've dived ScubaPro and was not impressed in the least. For some reason, they felt a bit "off." A couple of the early Dacors were good but Dacor is gone now. I've never dived Atomics, so I can't opine on them. Of the regs I have used, the Aqua-Lungs have always been my favorite and the Conshelfs are my favorite Aqua-Lungs. The Aqua-Lung Aquarius comes in a very close second.

---------- Post Merged at 10:56 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 10:52 PM ----------

To my mind, this thread (and a suprising number of other regulator threads) is a classic display of the effects of Cognitive Dissonance. I like this sentence from Wikipedia
"A general view of cognitive dissonance is when one is biased towards a certain decision even though other factors favour an alternative".

When people have invested in a particular belief system, they feel particularly uncomfortable when presented with evidence that challenges that belief. So they argue against it to try to prove to themselves that they are in fact correct, and that the others are wrong. The more they are invested in a particular system (i.e their livelyhood, or their reputation in advice they have given over the years) the harder they will rebell and argue against anything or anyone that present evidence that undermines that system.

I may not know about regulators, but I do know about moderating forums, and this effect is the underpinning principle behind the "fanboi" effect you see, where people will defend their product of choice against all rational argument. Because to accept that maybe the opposing side has valid points, means that they in effect are wrong, and that their previous decision tree was in some way flawed. I have found that people with IT, Engineering, and Military backgrounds are the worst offenders, whereas scientists and doctors are the least likely to exhibit this behaviour - i'm guessing the latter are specifically trained to accept that they can be wrong and to embrace it, while the former are taught to defend their decisions.

Anyway, I guess the point is, there will never be any kind of consensus in these threads, because people have too much emotional energy tied up their product choice, and don't recognise the uncomfortable - almost insulting or angry - feeling for what it is: Cognitive Dissonance.

If by all the above you mean that people don't like to admit (and have their noses rubbed in) the possibility that they made a bad decision, then you're right.

 

[JohnN]

Reliability, durability, features, warranty, how it breathes, weight

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So lets talk about warranty.

SP has a limited warranty (like most everyone else)

If you want the oft-talked about "parts for life" you're in for the regulator+ octo + BC + computer.

Here is the link, if you have any doubts: http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/scubapro/407051-scubapro-parts-life-policy-explained.html

Sounds like either very smart marketing or a cult. . .

 

[Paladin]

So lets talk about warranty.

SP has a limited warranty (like most everyone else)

If you want the oft-talked about "parts for life" you're in for the regulator+ octo + BC + computer.

Here is the link, if you have any doubts: http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/scubapro/407051-scubapro-parts-life-policy-explained.html

Sounds like either very smart marketing or a cult. . .

I have a lifetime warranty on all my regs. But then, I service my own!

 

[KJSmith84]

I did a lot of research before I purchased my SG-1000. I wish I could have afforded the Scubapro MK17/A700. My friends in my dive club use the MK17/A700 and love it for it's reliability, and the ease of breathing. I have tried it myself, and really wish I could have afforded to buy it for myself. The MK17/A700 would be my regulator of choice.

So the a700 is that much better than the 600?

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[Eric Sedletzky]

Don't forget brother Zung, he has photo and link for any question you might have.

Yes, of course brother Zung, and also brother Couv.
And everyone else I may have missed.

 

[JohnN]

So the a700 is that much better than the 600?

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I'm in awe. You clearly have much more money than me. For the price of a MK17/A700 + SP Octo, I got two HOG D1 secondaries, a D1 cold water primary, dual gauge (pressure + depth), 7' primary hose, bungee secondary hose, HOG SS backplate, harness and 32# wing (plus some misc. bolt snaps, bag for the regulators, a different color cover for the primary, and an extra inflator hose).

Damn, you pretty smart man

 

[KJSmith84]

I'm in awe. You clearly have much more money than me. For the price of a MK17/A700 + SP Octo, I got two HOG D1 secondaries, a D1 cold water primary, dual gauge (pressure + depth), 7' primary hose, bungee secondary hose, HOG SS backplate, harness and 32# wing (plus some misc. bolt snaps, bag for the regulators, a different color cover for the primary, and an extra inflator hose).

Damn, you pretty smart man

I tend not to just buy stuff just because it is cheap.
Not to mention when im talking about my life.

Harbor freight has cheap stuff and works great but it anit no craftsman. Is that tool going to fail when u need it the most? But he'll u got a great deal on it so it doesn't matter. Right?

Not saying that hog is anything bad. But I much rather stick with a product that I feel conformable with.

Its crazy that EVERY diver I have talked to has NEVER heard about hog too.

Seems as it must be a forum sensation here on scubaboard; im guessing since hog does a great job promoting and offering great pricing hear on sb.

Again NOT taking anything away from hog just something I have found out while researching regs.

I can't say wait a good reg or not. Im just trying to do my homework and listen to the guys that have tried them all and have been diving a long time.

So I thank everyone that has helped out in this thread so far.


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