Help??

[Puffer Fish]

Thanks guys for the input...Most all the instructors,Divemasters,etc.at my local dive shop seem to not much like the inflator/regulator combo.They all tend to stick with the traditional set-up.

Remember Instructors get to use their octo's a lot.

I like inflator/regulators... I find they make great inflators and at least the ones I have, have never had any issue. And I have a wireless computer...but I only use that configuration on shallow dives. My travel kit is with an Octo.. my deep diving is with an octo and second gas source...

Most octo/inflators are no fun to breath off of below 100 ft (atomic is the only exception I know of)...but at 60 ft or less, they all work pretty good.

I would suggest you get what you like...

 

[Kunundrum]

Remember Instructors get to use their octo's a lot.

I like inflator/regulators... I find they make great inflators and at least the ones I have, have never had any issue. And I have a wireless computer...but I only use that configuration on shallow dives. My travel kit is with an Octo.. my deep diving is with an octo and second gas source...

Most octo/inflators are no fun to breath off of below 100 ft (atomic is the only exception I know of)...but at 60 ft or less, they all work pretty good.

I would suggest you get what you like...

As he said.

Instructors use Octos every time they teach a class, this is a lot more use than a standard diver would subject to an octo.

Of the 3 Instructors I works with 2 of them use Air2 one does not. However the two that Do, will install an octo temporarily for the class, having 3 regulators total.

This is where you evaluate where you want to take diving, if you eventually want to go to the instructing level then yes it would be beneficial to have an "real" octo. if you just want to have fun diving there is no reason you can't use an combined Inflator/regulator (unless you plan to dive in Israel but this is a different matter) as mentioned previously it's like a spare tire, if it's likely you will use it alot you will want a full size spare, though if you don't plan on using it, you will be happy with the "donut" spare to get you out of trouble, the same applies to the Octo. if it has the capability to get you/your buddy to the surface safely in an emergency it has done it's job. How well it does this as compared to your "primary" 2nd is secondary at best.

 

[rstofer]

I posted earlier about trying an experiment.

In some ways, the experiment will be flawed if you dive in warm water. I have an AIR II on my old SeaQuest ADVi jacket style BC that I used when I was diving in warm water (it has been retired in favor of a BP/W). In this situation, the AIR II will be fine because there is very little change in buoyancy during an ascent. There won't be a need to vent much (or any) air from the BC.

However, in cold water with a 7mm wetsuit, if you are trying to control the ascent of two divers from depth, you will find two things: first, you will need some buoyancy from the victim's BC or you won't get off the bottom (at significant depth with a full tank). Second, you have the problem of holding on to the victim who is breathing from your regulator, venting the victim's BC and venting your own BC from the very device you are breathing from. It is going to be awkward!

I used my AIR II down to 113' and it worked fine. Sure, it didn't breathe as well as my primary but it was adequate. After all, I wasn't going to be using it very long. But I never had to deal with massive changes in buoyancy. My new setup has a necklaced octo and a 5' primary hose.

I'm not sure I like the long hose because I still have a snorkel on my mask strap. I don't think I am willing to give up the snorkel so I may revert to a shorter hose.

Richard

 

[Puffer Fish]

I posted earlier about trying an experiment.

In some ways, the experiment will be flawed if you dive in warm water. I have an AIR II on my old SeaQuest ADVi jacket style BC that I used when I was diving in warm water (it has been retired in favor of a BP/W). In this situation, the AIR II will be fine because there is very little change in buoyancy during an ascent. There won't be a need to vent much (or any) air from the BC.

However, in cold water with a 7mm wetsuit, if you are trying to control the ascent of two divers from depth, you will find two things: first, you will need some buoyancy from the victim's BC or you won't get off the bottom (at significant depth with a full tank). Second, you have the problem of holding on to the victim who is breathing from your regulator, venting the victim's BC and venting your own BC from the very device you are breathing from. It is going to be awkward!

I used my AIR II down to 113' and it worked fine. Sure, it didn't breathe as well as my primary but it was adequate. After all, I wasn't going to be using it very long. But I never had to deal with massive changes in buoyancy. My new setup has a necklaced octo and a 5' primary hose.

I'm not sure I like the long hose because I still have a snorkel on my mask strap. I don't think I am willing to give up the snorkel so I may revert to a shorter hose.

Richard

Richard, excellent point. I add an octo when diving deep or diving cold. My air II is just an inflator at that point.

 

[diver 85]

New to diving I'm begining to make equipment purchases however I can't decide on the usual Octo as back-up second stage or i've been lookin at the Aqua Lung Airsource 3.My Primary second stage is the Aqualung Mikron.I used the typical Octo on my confined and open water dives,but the thought of looseing that extra hose is appealing.I know I would need some getting used to the Airsource 3,but since i'm just starting out I thought it would be a good time?Any thoughts or opinions?Also what about the Vyper Air vs Galileo Luna?I used the Cobra 3 and liked it,but the thought of losing another hose once again is appealing.

Do you really think "looseing that extra hose" is really gunna make a difference???....I'm gunna bet not....To me it's kinda like the computer IE it was great so virtually everyone dives with one(lol or 2) these days, I know I resisted for about 20 years.....Now, what's the % of divers using an Air2 or 3(or whatever you want to call them?)--OR heck, you can throw the %s of BC's, SPGs etc etc etc........think about that for a moment.....

 

[Codiak]

Air2 and 1 less hose does make for lighter and easier to manage travel kit and seems well suited for typical recreational diving. I have one my BC.

However, if you intend to do more technical dives, like Caveren / Cave / Wreck you will need an Octo on a long hose anyway. I have a long hose as well.

If your diving deep and carry a pony, having both the Air2 on the BC and the Octo attached the pony is nice especially when traveling.

It's a matter of your comfort and ability to use the equipment properly when required.

 

[BDCollins]

Diver 85.
Not having near the experience or knowledge that you or any of the other posters as far as that goes I value everyones input,knowledge and opinion.Looseing not just 1 hose(no typical Octo)but 2(going with Vyper Air w/wirless transmitter)will make a big difference.I like the simple streamlined approach.Now it may not be what i'm expecting,but I figure if I go this route and don't like it i'm only out maybe $200 and could recoup some of that on the sell of the inflator/Reg.I think everyone's biggest concern is the OOA situation with your buddy and I totally agree it woud be tricky and akward to give them my primary,me use the inflator,and perform a proper accent,but on the otherhand the easiest way to make sure this never happens is planning and most important both you and your buddy closely monitor SPG's.All of my diving will be in water temps above 65 degrees.I at this point don't think i'm interested in cave,cavern,or Tech diving maybe Wreck though.And i'm only Advanced Open Water so 100 ft max on depth.Thanks again guys!!I just can't make my mind up and all points and opinions are being considered highly.


Barry
"I didn't come to Do it.I came to Dive it"

 

[Downing]

I like the simple streamlined approach.Now it may not be what i'm expecting,but I figure if I go this route and don't like it i'm only out maybe $200 and could recoup some of that on the sell of the inflator/Reg.

Part of the fun of this sport, at least for me, is playing around with new gear. Over time as you expand your diving horizons you're probably going to end up with lots of different types of gear and there's nothing wrong with that. Early on you probably should focus on gear that you're reasonably sure you're going to use but as time goes on you're probably going to have a gear bag or two full of stuff that you use only occasionally if at all.

I'd venture a guess that many if not most experienced divers have purchased at least one piece of gear that in hindsight was a mistake. I certainly have. Sh*t happens. No big deal. There's actually a funny thread about that somewhere on this board.

These days I've pretty much settled on a three Miflex hose configuration, with a titanium reg and combo inflator/safe second and an air integrated computer. Fairly expensive but very lightweight, easy to pack and easy to deal with. It's a setup that works well for me but it's not like it's the only setup that works well for me and it wouldn't necessarily work well for others.

Have fun! This sport's a blast.

 

[rstofer]

Diver 85.
Not having near the experience or knowledge that you or any of the other posters as far as that goes I value everyones input,knowledge and opinion.Looseing not just 1 hose(no typical Octo)but 2(going with Vyper Air w/wirless transmitter)will make a big difference.

Here we part company. Whether to eliminate a hose by using an AIR II type device is one thing. I can live with that, and have. But not having an SPG is, for me, out of the question. Even if I had a wireless air integrated computer, I would ALWAYS have an SPG.

The only thing keeping me alive underwater is the air in my tank. I want to know how much there is and I certainly don't intend to trust my life to a silicon diode.

I'm not sure reducing hose count makes ANY difference. The new Miflex hoses are pretty light and quite flexible. The diameter of their HP hose is less than a pencil.

With the long hose primary and necklaced octo, all hoses wind up being routed very close to the body. There are no hoses flying free like you see in the advertisements. As a result, the hoses are not creating much additional drag. So, the only possible gain is reducing flying weight and that's just foolishness. How much could possibly be saved? And really, how much drag could they create anyway?

I like the idea of the necklaced octo. Of all the changes over the last 20 years, I think this is the one that makes the most sense. The regulator is dangling just inches below your chin, right where you can find it when you need it. It certainly won't be dragging in the sand. Donating the primary also makes a lot of sense. For one thing, the 'victim' knows that it was working a few seconds ago.

Another thing to consider with the AIR II type device is the way it dangles from a hose that, by definition, can't be tied down. If you tend to get close to the bottom, there is a possibility that the reg will get filled with debris.

Richard

 

[BDCollins]

Richard,
You are correct about why should you trust your life to just a silicon diode,and once again being new to the sport I have to ask this.Why do the even make a wireless unit like the Vyper Air if knowone trust it as their SPG? It's suppose to do it's job reading your PSI,so what would be the point in using this configuration if you also used the typical "hosed" SPG?Thanks!!