Help End Shark Finning and the sale of Shark Products

[DazedAndConfuzed]

dude, all I am saying clicktivist might make the person feel good, but it doesn't work. You got to get off your ass and be an activist in order to get things to happen.

 

[highdesert]

It's pretty clear that you're never going to grasp that the Internet is, despite all of its shortcomings and useless sites, a tool to join millions of people worldwide, and the causes they believe in, together. This will only increase as time passes, and there will be a whole lot of clicking going on. Apparently you feel that unless someone is marching in the street throwing Molotov cocktails, nothing can be accomplished. Maybe we should give China 72 hours to cease consuming shark products or we'll carpet bomb the country ... will that satisfy your needs?

Activism can take many forms. Either you don't understand that, or don't want to. I'm done ... but I'm sure you're not. Have a great day.

 

[divergal65]

... be an activist in order to get things to happen.

"Things" have happened. You saw the list highdesert gave regarding all the countries and US states that have now passed INTO LAW a ban on the sale, distribution and harvesting of shark fins, primarily because activists (including "clicktivists"), along with scientists, and tourism related businesses saw what was happening and decided to do something.
If you ask me, that is definitely a concrete result.

 

[DazedAndConfuzed]

"Things" have happened. You saw the list highdesert gave regarding all the countries and US states that have now passed INTO LAW a ban on the sale, distribution and harvesting of shark fins, primarily because activists (including "clicktivists"), along with scientists, and tourism related businesses saw what was happening and decided to do something.
If you ask me, that is definitely a concrete result.

I said banning finning is a easy target when you and your country is not the consumer. The Chinese govt not taking a stand allows its activist (not clicktivist) to make an inroad. I am still awaiting the banning of factory whale hunting to succeed. A billion clicks from people in the US will not make a difference when Japan's govt are officially against a ban of any type. The activists risks their life to make the public aware of the issues, unfortunately, those issues don't seem to sink into the minds of people in Japan (issues like whale hunting, dolphin harvesting, the extinction of bluefin tuna, etc).

 

[divergal65]

I said banning finning is a easy target when you and your country is not the consumer.

California has one of the largest, if not the largest Chinese population outside of Asia, I'd say that is a valid target.It will have a dramatic effect - undoubtedly there will be a black market created, but the supply should decrease as time goes on.
One other notable aside is that the bill in California was created by a Chinese American , Paul Fong, D-Mountain View. So any racial overtones are mitigated by this fact.
As I have mentioned, I do what I can to make my friends and family aware of the destructive effects of finning, please pardon me for being so impertinent but may I ask what you do?

 

[DazedAndConfuzed]

California has one of the largest, if not the largest Chinese population outside of Asia, I'd say that is a valid target.It will have a dramatic effect - undoubtedly there will be a black market created, but the supply should decrease as time goes on.
One other notable aside is that the bill in California was created by a Chinese American , Paul Fong, D-Mountain View. So any racial overtones are mitigated by this fact.
As I have mentioned, I do what I can to make my friends and family aware of the destructive effects of finning, please pardon me for being so impertinent but may I ask what you do?

I discussed this already. You could push a law when there is no opposition. The AZNs there has no power and get pushed over or just roll over and die. Look at the japanese and their self defeatism by marching themselves to concentration camps during WWII.

I have also discussed when places like SF tries to put a ban on child abuse practice on ballot initiative, the child abusers were not going to roll over and croak, but instead got the 'liberal' governor Brown to ban the ban of the child abuse practice, even before anybody had passed any law banning it.

Nobody I know eats shark fin anymore, that is like a 5 year old topic in my circle. Stupid dimsum has some stuffed in there once in a while.

 

[divergal65]

I discussed this already. You could push a law when there is no opposition. The AZNs there has no power and get pushed over or just roll over and die. Look at the japanese and their self defeatism by marching themselves to concentration camps during WWII.

Wow, that's quite a statement!!!
The Asians in Cali have no power? There was opposition- I saw a newscast in Sf where many Chinatown merchants protested the ban.In California, there are more Asian council members , mayors, state and local representatives and Congress people than ever before, and the number keeps growing. Oakland just elected their first Chinese American mayor, Jean Quan, San Francisco currently has a Chinese American mayor and this fall several other Chinese Americans as well as a Japanese American are running for mayor.The mayor and most of the council members of Monterey Park are asian- mainly Taiwanese. Many city councils in the Los Angeles and San Francisco Bay area are majority Asian - look it up yourself. Also, You did see where I wrote that this bill WAS WRITTEN BY A CHINESE AMERICAN?.Apparently not all Asians think the same way as you. Imagine that!
As for the Japanese American experience during WW2, some members of my husbands family during WW2 in America were given 72 hours to vacate their premises and forced at gunpoint by US army personnel to board cattle trains to the interior of the country. I wouldn't exactly say that they marched themselves to the camps. You should really read up on some of the history of that period, because if you had, you wouldn't have made such a wildly ignorant comment. Also, have you ever heard of Fred Korematsu, Gordon Hirabayashi and Minoru Yasui? Or the NoNo boys? THe 442nd and 100th All Nisei combat regiments? If you call them self defeatists, that would be truly be amazing.They fought for their rights As Americans and proved themselves right.

"I have also discussed when places like SF tries to put a ban on child abuse practice on ballot initiative, the child abusers were not going to roll over and croak, but instead got the 'liberal' governor Brown to ban the ban of the child abuse practice, even before anybody had passed any law banning it."

You must be talking about the circumcision ban? If you want to argue circumcision is child abuse, go ahead. By calling the people who were for circumcision "child abusers" is also quite a statement ...so members of religions who practice circumcision are "child abusers"? Governor Brown rescinded the putative ban because State law says that health matters are affairs of the state not cities, so its more of a question on who has jurisdiction over such a matter.I neither support nor condemn circumcision by the way.

But ultimately, it boils down to facts- shark populations around the world are plummeting precipitously and a major contributing factor is shark finning. Legislation against it is growing worldwide and with that, the full force of government agencies is also behind it. However, it might already be too late. If sharks are wiped out, we'll have to live with the consequences. I and others have provided links to the effects already seen in areas where shark populations were decimated. If this doesn't bother you, that's your choice. My choice is to do something.

Since this thread is veering wildly off topic here, if you'd like to reply, please PM me.

 

[divergal65]

More bad news:

Shark massacre reported in Colombian waters | Environment | guardian.co.uk

 

[highdesert]

This sickens me. We dived Malpelo three months ago and swam in the midst of schools of hammerheads and silkies. For all I know the sharks in these photos are now carcasses on the bottom of the Pacific. The President of Costa Rica is now the recipient of worldwide condemnation for allowing this, and they are reviewing their maritime laws regarding flagging of foreign vessels.

 

[DazedAndConfuzed]

California bans trade or posession of fins, but does not ban catching of sharks, except for the fins. So the people hunting sharks has to ditch the fins before bringing it back on shore?