Heart attack and a new diver

[Stormingheaven]

TSandM thank you for that informative link. I know that he meets all of the guidelines of that posting.

Now for a bit of a twist. I talked with my friend tonight and asked him if he had given any thoughts about his cardiac history and how it may pertain to getting his OW. I told him that he should let his instructor know about his medical history and see what he has to say. Good thing he's my friend. He asked, "so what does this instructor do for a living?". I told him I believed he was a sales rep. but he he has been a dive instructor few quite a few years. He asked what in the **^(^%*%&^ business is his medical history to a salesman. He also went on somewhat heatedly that his private medical information is protected information. He said that he already has an appointment with his Cardiologist and intends to make sure he is healthy enough for diving, He intends to follow his recommendations to the letter but has no intentions of discussing his medical history with anyone not in the health care field. I have to say to a point I have to agree with him. It's his life and his responsibility to make sure he is able to dive safely.

 

[rstofer]

HIPAA certainly acts to protect health care information and your friend doesn't have to divulge any of it.

But the instructor will simply refuse to accept him as a student unless he fills out the questionnaire. If any answers are 'Yes' your friend will have to present a doctor's release clearing him to dive. Of course, your friend is free to lie if he wishes. Then again, if he is over the cutoff age (45 around here), even lying won't get him out of having to produce a doctor's release.

It's as simple as that! Present the proper information or the instructor WILL refuse to accept him as a student.

Richard

 

[GatorJoe]

imho, there needs to be a certain relationship of trust between u and your instructor and i think giving a limited amt of information is necessary. after all, you are putting your life into your instructors hands when you are learning.

 

[shugar]

get in touch with clgsamson in the PPD - he had a big attack and had a couple of stents put into his heart (or something like that)

but he's still diving and enjoying every moment of it...

if anyone knows he does...

Jag

 

[frogman159]

Now for a bit of a twist. I talked with my friend tonight and asked him if he had given any thoughts about his cardiac history and how it may pertain to getting his OW. I told him that he should let his instructor know about his medical history and see what he has to say. Good thing he's my friend. He asked, "so what does this instructor do for a living?". I told him I believed he was a sales rep. but he he has been a dive instructor few quite a few years. He asked what in the **^(^%*%&^ business is his medical history to a salesman. He also went on somewhat heatedly that his private medical information is protected information. He said that he already has an appointment with his Cardiologist and intends to make sure he is healthy enough for diving, He intends to follow his recommendations to the letter but has no intentions of discussing his medical history with anyone not in the health care field. I have to say to a point I have to agree with him. It's his life and his responsibility to make sure he is able to dive safely.

Well this is all well and good, and yes HIPPA does afford him the right to not share his health information. But just be aware that when he goes on a dive trip and plans on staying at a resort, he will likely have to fill out a similair questionare, and have MD sign off before they let him dive. I know Couples, All Sandles and subsidiaries, All Superclubs require this, there are probably many others that do too. What I'm saying is that he's going to be asked to share his health info with not only salesmen, but foriegn dive hut operators as well.

Of course he can do alot of lying. I would just have my Doc type a letter and sign it. Then when presented with these questionaires he doesn't have to keep going back for clearence. Of course he could lie, but then if something did happen his medical history would be unknown to first responders which isn't good either.

 

[don Francisco]

Let's take a moment and separate two issues.

The first is whether he is in fact fit to dive. If he has discussed his plans to dive with his cardiologist and the only person qualified to have an opinion says he is medically fit to dive, that should end it.

It's his option to share or not to share the particulars of his medical history if it has no bearing on possible risks to himself or others. He might simply ask his doctor to draft a simple letter stating that in his professional opinion, based on both his history and present condition he sees no medical contra-indications to diving, and not detailing the particulars. I carry a similarly worded letter and have it updated annually, because at my age, some operators insist on an exam prior to taking me diving.

The second relates to the contract between the diver and the instructor. The purpose of the medical form is twofold. It's to make prospective divers aware of possible risks that diving with their medical conditions may create. For example a diver may have mild asthma and not think about the implications. Since isn't reasonable to expect the prospective diver to know all the possible complications, nor is the instructor a medical expert knowlegable about this person, the form lists possible red flags, and then requires an expert opinion as to diver fitness.

It's perfectly reasonable protection for all parties. If however, someone like your friend did the homework and secured the medical opinion that his prior heart problem is a resolved thing of the past and there isn't any contra-indication to diving, then IMO for all practical purposes he does not have a heart condition now, and he might simply skip over that box.

I want to be clear, I am not suggesting lying. I'm saying that if one obtains an expert medical opinion that a condition is irrelevant to diving, then he may keep it private - no harm, no foul.

As a final thought, there are large numbers of folks out there with undiagnosed heart conditions, progressing coronary artery disease and the like, that honestly don't check the box. In the final analysis doesn't a "liar" who's been medically cleared, present less risk than an honest but unaware person?

 

[Dr. Doug Ebersole]

Thanks, Lynne. You saved me from writing a long post!

Stromingheaven -- I'm a cardiologist/technical diver/instructor. Bascially, if your friend has normal heart function and a normal stress test he can dive. However, DO NOT LIE on the medical release. Just have him be seen by his cardiologist before beginning diving. Also, I'd be happy to help in any way if his cardiologist is not experienced in diving issues.

Doug

 

[boulderjohn]

Your friend should know that for any agency I know, choosing not to submit the form is not an option. If he does not submit the form, he does not receive instruction. Maybe there is some outlying agency with different rules he can use, but I don't know what agency that would be. He can get as angry as he wants about it, but that won't change anything.

 

[DiverBizz]

I realize that this has already been stated but...DO NOT HAVE YOUR FRIEND LIE on the required forms. There is a very good reason for these questions. Do you want to be the one to inform the family that your good friend and dive buddy lost his life because you told him to avoid the physical check up by the cardiologist. If he is dive worthy you have a dive buddy, if he is not the cardio tells him so and you still have a good friend.

 

[Stormingheaven]

You all just ROCK!! Thank you so much. And thank you Dr. Doug.

My friend was up over the weekend and we went to the dive shop and looked around. He had a chance to ask a lot of questions and I think he is now comfortable being open about his medical history. He already has an appointment with his Cardiologist and intends to bring a letter clearing him to class. He already talked with his Dr. and he said there should be no problem, I guess his Doctor is a diver too.

This was a question that got me to thinking too. As a Paramedic I'm very tight when it comes to releasing medical information. When it comes to my own medical information I won't release it to anyone that doesn't have a "need to Know' and the expertize to use it. I did disclose all of my information to my dive instructor, there really isn't much outside of an ability to grow an abundant amount of added buoyancy anyway.

Anyway thank you so much for all of your help.

P.S. I also bought my first Worthington HP-100 while we were at the dive shop. January in northern Michigan and I need a new tank...go figure.