Guided Dive cert card????

[RTee]

Well, as for myself, I do not let people touch my gear except my diving buddy as part of the pre-dive check so he or she gets acquainted with my rigging, weight system, octo, etc.

Being in the aviation business, if I ever get interrupted doing checks, I will start them over. If somebody does anything to my platform, I will look at it over again. When I seriously resumed scuba diving in Mar 2009, my first diving trip was in Cozumel. Very professional organization I dealt with but I vividly recalled one tank being dropped somehow when one of the DM was just trying to help the customer by setting-up her equipment...end result...tank toppled hitting the deck first stage first and damaging the reg assembly.

I always did my own rigging and set-up and the one thing that caused me heartburns was to see the DM fidgeting with my rig once it had been all set-up and tested...to the point that I had to redo my own pre-dive check...remember what I said about somebody touching my helo after I am satisfied with its condition...This occured only once because It became part of my traditional morning greetings... Buenos Dias how are you?...FYI, I set-up my own equipment and I don't want anybody doing anything to it except my buddy as part of the pre-dive check...I had a great diving week afterward.

 

[macado]

I always setup my own gear and would prefer DMs not set it up however I have no problem with them double checking the inflater value or checking regulators. Sometimes a 2nd set of eyes isnt a bad thing.

Only times i've had shops try setting up my gear was in Thailand so it's not necessarily limited to North American markets.

 

[ZenDiver.3D]

Note that I am not picking on anyone, just making a statement about DMs .

The DM is not there to set your gear or plan your dive or check your gear.
The DM is there to provide assistance when neccesary, to make sure everyone has a buddy, to assist the captain, offer aid with entries and exits, to be available in case of emergencies, to provide boat and site briefings, adn to oversee the dives. They are not valets and should not be checking everyone's gear unless requested by the customer. They guide dives in some areas, don't even get wet in others.
I think DM's have become boat slaves instead of the dive professionals they are. As an instructor, you would never expect me to set your gear, yet they expect the DM to do it? Nope. Not in my book. I think shops and some customers have unrealistic and insulting expectations of DMs. They are dive professionals, not maids. Unfortunately, many places have turned them into just that. And those DMs have allowed it, so they have to take some of the responsibility.

As to vacation divers who don't remember how to set their gear. They should do a refresher, then, and practice. Someone who doesn't remember how to set their gear, probably doesn't remember how to problem solve at depth either.

 

[mistressmotorsports]

Note that I am not picking on anyone, just making a statement about DMs .

The DM is not there to set your gear or plan your dive or check your gear.
The DM is there to provide assistance when neccesary, to make sure everyone has a buddy, to assist the captain, offer aid with entries and exits, to be available in case of emergencies, to provide boat and site briefings, adn to oversee the dives. .

That is a perfectly acceptable definition of DM for YOU. However, in a lot of vacation markets, you have people using rental gear, people who are less than capable of setting up their own or rental gear, etc. And, even if all these people had their own gear and could set them up, many dive ops have discovered that customer service is a value added commodity, and so they make it a policy for their EE's to help the diver do as little as possible (I mean this in a good, being helpful way.) They also ask the DM's to be guides, point out interesting marine life, find the boat, etc. So, for the people that enjoy this kind of valet service, there is nothing wrong with it, and in fact, that's what many customers are paying for. You may prefer your definition, but I see nothing wrong with providing expert above and under water services as a sales tool that enhances the customer's experience.

Mike

 

[String]

The DM is not there to set your gear or plan your dive or check your gear.
The DM is there to provide assistance when neccesary, to make sure everyone has a buddy, to assist the captain, offer aid with entries and exits, to be available in case of emergencies, to provide boat and site briefings, adn to oversee the dives.

Bingo! Thats the text book definition of a DM from the agency and also the definition used in law in some countries (egypt etc). A DM isnt there to be a slave, a nanny or anything. He's dealing with *qualified divers* when not assisting on an open water course so they should be responsible for their own safety. A DM is logistics and organisation of surface support.

Lots of places don't have them at all and as you said in lots of places they don't get wet.

who are less than capable of setting up their own or rental gear, etc.

So a scuba review is needed then. If they've forgotten the basic setup of their own dive gear who knows what else has been forgotten? Should be a confined skills review at least.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Those who do not know how to set up their own gear, forgot how, or refuse to-stay out of the water. I would not dive with any of them. They are poorly trained, too long out, or just plain lazy. All of which do not inspire any confidence as to their ability to handle an emergency underwater. The DM should not be touching anyone's gear outside of the classroom or pool setting. And only then to verify it. IF a problem is found they do not correct it but inform the diver what the problem is and have them correct it themself. Catering to and encouraging what can only be seen as incompetent behavior is how a lot of places seem to be going.

Why? I'm guessing because in reality the ops are smart and intelligent enough to know that what they are getting for customers more and more are those who can barely survive, if they can, without a babysitter. Yet instead of saying to the shops and agencies stop sending us accidents waiting to happen they see dollar signs.

I'm planning on putting together a trip for some of my students next year if all goes well. When we get to wherever we are going I better not see one of them allow or worse yet require a DM or Guide's assistance in setting up gear. In fact I may tell the op when booking that we do not need a DM for that. We don't want one in the water. And if they want a good tip they'll get us to the site, give a good briefing, then stay out of our way until we are done diving. IF they do that they will be looking at a much better tip.

Had the DM ripped my mouthpiece she would have heard about it. Had she touched my inflator and filled my wing like that she would have been stopped physically. Do I fault her totally? No. She is only reacting to the piss poor trained divers being sent to her on a regular basis that they are probably disgusted with and take some satisfaction in digging at them whenever they can.

Short version- touch my gear- no money. Mess with my valves-I now have a reason to turn around, set my gear down, and redo all of it. Swim like a fool to get people to burn through their air- I will not be following you and will ignore your commands until my alloted time is up. I would not be surprised if sometimes they also take people deeper to shorten dive times. If I had an hour and they said we are going to take everyone to 70 feet on a reef that starts at 30, and we have a hour. Chances are a few are going to go low and have to cut the dive short. They will not affect my time. I'll just stay at 30 or 40 and at 59:30 I'll becoming back up the ladder.

 

[flots am]

Short version- touch my gear- no money. Mess with my valves-I now have a reason to turn around, set my gear down, and redo all of it. Swim like a fool to get people to burn through their air- I will not be following you and will ignore your commands until my alloted time is up. I would not be surprised if sometimes they also take people deeper to shorten dive times. If I had an hour and they said we are going to take everyone to 70 feet on a reef that starts at 30, and we have a hour. Chances are a few are going to go low and have to cut the dive short. They will not affect my time. I'll just stay at 30 or 40 and at 59:30 I'll becoming back up the ladder.

Wow, you're grumpy! Lighten up a little. Make sure you can breathe, and dive where you're happy.

The most I've ever seen a DM do to assembled equipment is check the tank valve and sometimes the BC inflator. Just check it again and go diving.

Flots.

 

[nielsent]

I happen to appreciate value added service. However, as a DM, me doing everything for a diver including setting up their gear, checking it, holding their hand in the water, bringing them back and all that other jazz is not value added service. All that this sort of service is promoting the behaviors of unprepared, lazy, and perhaps dangerous divers.

As a DM I don't like being a babysitter, or a gear setup monkey, or a tank sherpa. I am a role model and assistant to those I dive with, and more importantly I am a dive professional. I do not see these things as my job because these are the responsibility of the divers.

I would never deny assistance if it was asked of me, but I am not there to do the job for a certified diver. If a diver is shaky and needs help I walk them through the steps, but make them do the work. If I am concerned about their abilities, I would be recommending a scuba review, and not recommending they be out on a boat. If I see poor skills underwater I do my best to work with the divers to help hone their techniques. But most importantly, I like to communicate up front what I am there for and what I expect from the divers in my care.

By offering advice, helping people improve their abilities by making them do things for themselves, you are giving them confidence. Confidence makes people happy, and excited to go out and dive more. That is value added service.

Does this piss some people off? Absolutely, especially those that think they should be catered to because they paid their 75 bucks for the dive. However, this is frustrating to the DM’s as well, because we are the people that have to take all the flak from all directions and end up doing all the work, and depending on where they are, with little or no pay. But there is only one way to change the way people view diving charter services, and that’s through communication, gentle understanding and patience.

It reminds me of the old adage: Build a man a fire he’ll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, he’ll be warm for the rest of his life.