"Guided" 200' dive with a single AL80?

[Skull]

Has it occurred to you that since you lack deco training yourself, you aren't in the best position to evaluate what was done right and what was done wrong on this dive?

Hmmm really ...ever dive with me? Assuming alot there ...oh thats right I don't update my profile as often as I should ...oh well assume all you want

 

[xiSkiGuy]

Hmmm really ...ever dive with me? Assuming alot there ...oh thats right I don't update my profile as often as I should ...oh well assume all you want

Well by all means, please tell us all about the deco training you have. . . .

 

[Mike Edmonston]

Dennis ... the guy does a few bounce dives ...therefore he needs to buy trimix from you ...nice

Second the technical divers I know send ALL OF THEIR OWN EQUIPMENT with them charged and good to go

uh... which airline ships their full tanks, i'd like to know please???

...not one of my buddies would consider renting from a trimix shop

Well... that's because you guys have no mix experience, and you're recreational divers on air, therefore you have no need for it.

...period specially in Mexico or Honduras. Come on Dennis get a grip.

You're right skull, us trimix divers are just narced out of our minds. I can't believe I wasted all that money and time on training. I'm such an idiot! Where's that 300' extention for my hookah rig, I'm going on the Doria!

You don't know what you don't know!

Cheers

 

[Skull]

Well, I personally think that his accounts are untrue. Fabricated, NO, exagerated, yes. 200ft with the species of reef fish and ambient light seen on the video... I don't think so.


I have no interest in spelling out my diving history or experience or my time on Nuclear submarines etc... Do a search on SB or Decostop and you'll get a better idea.
And according to you he has more than 28 years experience, good for him.



Yup, I'm just a fat Floridian cave diver. I keep meaning to get in better shape, but I really enjoy food. Besides, my wife is happy with me just the way I am, and my dog still likes me. I'm sure he has phenomenal sac rate, again good for him. What about the sac rate of the people he was guiding??....



Yup, you know everything.



I have no intention on diving with the guy, I don't care what he does with himself. As long as he guides clients to depths way beyond safe recreational limits and brags about it, I will have a problem with it.

Skull, seriously, the best thing you could do is take a class in advanced nitrox and deco procedures. This is not a slam, but you don't know what you don't know. I see that you enjoy diving, and the aformentioned classes would fit right in with your diving style. Specially if you want to spear the big fish. I really think that you would enjoy the classes alot.

Safe diving...

Mike two things ...what makes tyoou think I haven't taken all of the NAUI tech courses and second ...what does that have to do with destroying some guys business?

Also Mike my point about his SAC was to inform you that he looks to be in pretty good shape ...not to slam you but to get you to think beyond the emotional stuff and evaluate his entire operation ... he is running a pretty good op down there ...at least by his web site and customers comments.

Finally if you read his post all four of them were buddies ...cut the guy some slack.Apparently he wants to learn from Pez ...good for him ...as I said before he should take a tech intro, deco and mixed gas course..at the very least.

 

[Mike Edmonston]

Here's a video of Yuri Lipskis doing a bounce dive on an al80.
YouTube - Yuri Lipskis Fatal Dive

By the way, you can hear him gasping as he died.
I guess everything didn't go as planned
Enjoy your deep air bounce dives.

 

[Nemrod]

I really don't want to get into a Gas planning workshop here.

Yes, you can dive to 200' on air on an 80. What happens if your buddy has a reg freeflow and needs to buddy breathe off your bottle. Does your gas plan take that into account? how do you pick who dies or blows off Deco? Rock paper scissors?

You guys can do whatever you want, and as long as everything works flawlessly, you should survive. I for one like to plan for the worst, and I would like to make sure that I have enough gas for my buddy and my deco.

Training is available, and reasonably priced. Why is everyone so against learning to dive safely??

I got the guided information from the guy's own blog. You should read it, it's a hoot...

Well, you are right and prudent and practical but the dive could be done on an 80 following the Rule of Thirds, 1000, down, 1000 up and 1000 reserve and that reserve 1000 would be for the buddy with a problem. We are not doing a deco dive (190 for 5 minutes is no deco--a bounce) so redundancy is no more important that it would be at 130 feet at 10 minutes on the Mighty O which is a dive they do all the time as have I (well not exactly bare--I had a pony). I would do it solo anyways and I have done such dives.

My biggest concern with a 200 foot dive and an inexperienced diver doing it is narcosis and the reality of having to stick closely to a dive plan for which deviation from could be very bad--same at 139 feet on the O.

My only point is we seem to draw artificial boundries, 60 feet, 130 feet, 200 feet.


AND, your right, diving to 200 feet on air is not practical and not recommended on a 80 cf tank.

I also would say that no more than 100 feet on an 80 cf tank is prudent and practical--beyond that depth--yeah--you can do it but it is pushing it from practical issues. Frankly I think the minimum equipment for the O (as an example) should be a single 100cf tank and a 19 to 30 cf pony). With that you could do a practical dive to 130 feet on 28% with adequate reserves for a no deco dive (most could).

N

 

[Skull]

Well, I am just trying ot figure this out, we are saying 200 is to deep on a 80 cf tank so my question, is 150' OK, howabout 130', at what depth is an 80 safe?

Frankly, I don't think bouncing 200 feet is all that dangerous. On a relative scale:

SAFE<1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10>Dangerous

I am just going to give a 200 foot bounce a 5.

Riding a motorcycle in a metro area, 7.

Eating milktoast, .5.

Running with the bulls, 7.

Hunting with Dick Cheny, 9.

N

Once again "N" ...Nice ! as usual

 

[Skull]

there are a lot of members on here, who are assuming a lot of information when they make their comments.
first, correct me if i'm wrong, but i saw nothing in the quote about the divers paying the guide. i also saw nothing about ratings, certifications or experience.
so i think the significance, of rather what they did was proper or safe, comes down to the divers ratings, certifications, abilities and experience.

i have worked in a place where we dived to 180 - 220 regularly, and with single 80's. with the proper training, certifications and experience, this is not a crazy thing. i recently did a multilevel dive on the st croix wall, where we hit the 190' depth, and didn't rush up from that depth. we used deep stops on our computers, and spent a nice amount of time at each stop, on the wall. all of us were using 80's, and we were not in a rush. of course all of us are active instructors, who dive every single day, so our air conservation is really good. but, my point is, that this isn't a situation that i would think would raise this much of a reaction. padi doesn't have a problem with this, unless you are taking sport divers down, and breaking the sport diving depth of 130'. but with higher ratings and experience this isn't a big deal.

deco diving is very popular in the south pacific, but seems to be a cardinal sin in and around america. but unfortunately, the american region lags way behind the south pacific in dive technique. i'm not trying to talk smack, but that is my experience.

that being said, you should never dive deep, if you don't have a higher rating than advanced open water, don't have deep diving experience and are not with buddies with deep diving experience. there are more than a few facets to consider here.

Thank you and I believe Dr Weinke would concur ...

 

[boomx5]

Thank you and I believe Dr Weinke would concur ...

You sure about that?

 

[Mike Edmonston]

what makes tyoou think I haven't taken all of the NAUI tech courses

I'll make you an offer, PM me with your name and when you got tech certified, and I'll check it out. It will take me 3 minutes tops. If you have all these certs as you say, I will take back what I said about you taking the classes. I will also issue you a public apology for doubting your training.

Deal??

Cheers